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Old 01-05-2010, 03:12 AM   #1
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Default PLEASE give credit to TSUKINEKO for SU SHIMMER PAINT

PLEASE give credit to TSUKINEKO for SU SHIMMER PAINT that SU currently sells.
I am not bashing SU in any way.
But in the Gallery there are many cards that say "SU SHIMMER PAINT" -
SU is NOT the maker of this product they are only selling 3 of the colors
Frost White - Champagne Mist - Platinum.
TSUKINEKO is the maker and it does show this on every bottle on the back.
I just hate a company getting credit for someone elses product.

TSUKINEKO has a whole line of this metallic shimmer paint and they also currently carry these 3 colors also. They and SU have an agreement for SU to carry these paints to bring them to stampers everywhere whixh I think is fabulous.

I did not start to start a fight or pick on anybody or thing. But like I said - I just do not like a company getting credit for a product that a different company produced and has in there current line.

Thank you
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Old 01-05-2010, 03:27 AM   #2
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Companies do this all the time. I just look at it as part of the business. I am sure they are getting well compensated for it as well. It still says TSUKINEKO on the packaging. I dont think that it is them "getting credit for someone elses product" it is just that SU is selling it. The same thing with all the 'EK Success' items that we sell.
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Old 01-05-2010, 03:38 AM   #3
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Quote:

Originally Posted by KalonismommyView Post
Companies do this all the time. I just look at it as part of the business. I am sure they are getting well compensated for it as well. It still says TSUKINEKO on the packaging. I dont think that it is them "getting credit for someone elses product" it is just that SU is selling it. The same thing with all the 'EK Success' items that we sell.
I understand what you are saying. But the difference is EK SUCCESS makes different exclusive items for SU.
Same with the Fiskars trimmers - it is black with the SU name. Therefore yes it is an SU product.
To me the shimmer paint is also current in the TSUKINEKO line and it is the exact same item and bottle but SU is getting the credit for it not TSUKINEKO.

So to me it is a different situation.
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Old 01-05-2010, 03:52 AM   #4
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Quote:

Originally Posted by meluvstampinView Post
PLEASE give credit to TSUKINEKO for SU SHIMMER PAINT that SU currently sells.
I am not bashing SU in any way.
But in the Gallery there are many cards that say "SU SHIMMER PAINT" -
SU is NOT the maker of this product they are only selling 3 of the colors
Frost White - Champagne Mist - Platinum.
TSUKINEKO is the maker and it does show this on every bottle on the back.
I just hate a company getting credit for someone elses product.

TSUKINEKO has a whole line of this metallic shimmer paint and they also currently carry these 3 colors also. They and SU have an agreement for SU to carry these paints to bring them to stampers everywhere whixh I think is fabulous.

I did not start to start a fight or pick on anybody or thing. But like I said - I just do not like a company getting credit for a product that a different company produced and has in there current line.

Thank you
People who buy it from SU know it as SU Shimmer Paint. I don't really think it's incumbent on consumers to research it to that extent. Really, is this even worth worrying about?
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Old 01-05-2010, 03:55 AM   #5
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Quote:

Originally Posted by meluvstampinView Post
I understand what you are saying. But the difference is EK SUCCESS makes different exclusive items for SU.
Same with the Fiskars trimmers - it is black with the SU name. Therefore yes it is an SU product.
To me the shimmer paint is also current in the TSUKINEKO line and it is the exact same item and bottle but SU is getting the credit for it not TSUKINEKO.

So to me it is a different situation.
Not necssarily true as I have seen some of the same EK SUCCESS and Fiskars punches in the store.
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Old 01-05-2010, 03:57 AM   #6
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Ok just wanted to talk about it more if you dont mind? You just dont like the fact that both companies are selling the same product at the same time? The reason I ask is because it is not labeled 'as' SU.. it is just in the mini.

EK sells a stamp positioner and the only difference is the color.

Fiskars crimper

And Tombo with SNAIL

I think the basic shapes (punches) are the same EK ones as well ... the whale style.

Would you have rather liked that SU changed the packaging so you would not be able to tell who it came from?

Is it that customers are specifically seeing the item as "shimmer paint" ( name given by SU!) and not all purpose paint .. name given by Tsukienko.


I personally would like to understand where you are coming from...

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Old 01-05-2010, 04:30 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by KalonismommyView Post
Ok just wanted to talk about it more if you dont mind? You just dont like the fact that both companies are selling the same product at the same time? The reason I ask is because it is not labeled 'as' SU.. it is just in the mini.

EK sells a stamp positioner and the only difference is the color.

Fiskars crimper

And Tombo with SNAIL

I think the basic shapes (punches) are the same EK ones as well ... the whale style.

Would you have rather liked that SU changed the packaging so you would not be able to tell who it came from?

Is it that customers are specifically seeing the item as "shimmer paint" ( name given by SU!) and not all purpose paint .. name given by Tsukienko.


I personally would like to understand where you are coming from...

I love the fact that SU is carrying it. It has opened up may new possibilities for stampers. BUT
I am one that really think credit needs to go to the company or artist of products.
other companies that make different products for certain line like SU and a few others and they change that product to be exclusive is great because you can only get that one from there.

It would just be nice if companies of products like this would get the credit
by just typing in a little line
Tsukineko Shimmer paint or SU/Tsukineko Shimmer paint
and this way other stampers looking in the gallery will know where to find these awesome products.

SU told all demos that they can incidentely say another company or product name if it is there own line - I respect this and well I also respect other companies and wish credit would also be given to them where it is due.

NOTE: I am not affiliated with any company. I just really wish credit to products and artists would be given to the makers.


If this is to hard to understand where I am coming from then lets drop this subject and we will call this thread to an end.
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Old 01-05-2010, 04:30 AM   #8
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I know when I was looking for examples a few months ago, I searched on "shimmer," and that was sufficient to bring up the samples I was looking for. I don't think there is a need to identify the brand one way or another -- SU or Tsuk....

I think for many people, SU was their first introduction to the shimmer paints, so that's why they make the association, but most customers are aware that SU does not manufacture every item or only sell exclusive items (ex: Stazon ink).
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Old 01-05-2010, 04:45 AM   #9
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Would you have rather liked that SU changed the packaging so you would not be able to tell who it came from?

Is it specifically when people are using the product they are saying SU Shimmer Paint?

Is it the fact that people are not mentioning it as the all-purpose ink?

Is it more about the restriction and the newer agreement.

I could understand and see you point if you issue was with SNAIL.. No where on the product does it mention that it is a Tombow Product and all signs point to it as being a 100% SU! product. It is the same exact item and can be used with SNAIL dispensers. Kwim? Even though it is not exactly the sitituation that would be asking someone to say they used tombow/snail. In this sitituation I would agree 100% because when customers that did not know that it was the same product and figure out the cost... frankly it sucks.

Honestly... and whole heartly I just want to get a better understanding of your point of view.
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Old 01-05-2010, 05:00 AM   #10
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I for one think it's incredibly helpful to know if a product is exclusive to a particular group or if it can be purchased elsewhere (and maybe in a bigger variety). If you haven't already purchased that product but are interested in it, but have had issues with the company who's listed here as getting credit for it being "their product", then you might miss out entirely on a great item. It's also nice to know who originally manufactures a product because a lot of times, you can get that same product elsewhere for less money. In my area, quality craft stores are basically non-existant and forget about a LSS, so already knowing that this product was available elsewhere isn't always obvious. I'd seen some techniques using the shimmer paints that I thought would be neat to try, but didn't particularly want to order from SU and didn't want those colors. Now that I know Tsukineko makes it, I can look elsewhere with a manufacturer name. I happen to like Tsukineko quality overall. Having the manufacturer's name is incredibly helpful if you haven't ordered the product before and have no other reference otherthan you can purchase it from SU. In this case, you might think that it's only available thru SU and only in those three colors. By getting the full story, it opens up a whole entire rainbow of color choices!

I'd like to thank meluvstampin for posting this. Since I hadn't purchased this product but was interested in it, I now know the name of who makes it, so I can search elsewhere for it in colors I want. Without this post, I probably wouldn't have asked lots of questions about the product (would take more time than I'd be interested in putting in) just to get info on it. Again, that you for posting!
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Old 01-05-2010, 05:51 AM   #11
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geogymnast82-

You previously posted about the "pinking hearts border" being the same ek one named "arrow border". This is the same sitituation ... however you did the research to know that 'they are the same' (I personally have not physically seen both of them but they do look like they are).
That is the consumers responsiblity not the sellers.
It really would not be good business practices for any business to release who their suppliers are ...

Like if you found out that Walmart's and Kmarts generic brand were made from the same manufacturer and they have several items that are the same. The only difference is the price and the logo. Would it be in Kmarts best interest to disclose that you can get it at a cheaper price at Walmart?
Should SU or people selling the product sell it as an EK item called Arrow Border Edger?
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Old 01-05-2010, 06:11 AM   #12
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Quote:

Originally Posted by KalonismommyView Post
geogymnast82-

You previously posted about the "pinking hearts border" being the same ek one named "arrow border". This is the same sitituation ... however you did the research to know that 'they are the same' (I personally have not physically seen both of them but they do look like they are).
That is the consumers responsiblity not the sellers.
It really would not be good business practices for any business to release who their suppliers are ...

Like if you found out that Walmart's and Kmarts generic brand were made from the same manufacturer and they have several items that are the same. The only difference is the price and the logo. Would it be in Kmarts best interest to disclose that you can get it at a cheaper price at Walmart?
Should SU or people selling the product sell it as an EK item called Arrow Border Edger?

I didn't say anything about that I thought it was the seller's responsibility to put that information out, but I for one love it when they do. The only reason I knew about the punch was that it's an item my Michael's (which is a smaller one and not that great) actually had. I didn't do any "research", I just happened to have seen the SU mini and knew that punch looked familiar from seeing it someplace else already. I was just stating how much I loved having the information about the shimmer paints. If I were SU, I wouldn't put the information out stating that they were manufactured by Tsukineko, and I don't even think SU's product guide lists who actually makes the products (their product guide doesn't have a lot of information in it). If I were the company, I wouldn't advertise that anyone could get it from anybody but me because I'd want them to buy it from me. But, here on SCS, it's nice to have the information listed about products. I know I hate seeing a card or project shown in the gallery with little to no information about who made the papers or stamps especially if they look like something I'd be interested in getting. If the information isn't there or incomplete, it means more work for me to try and track that information down, which I don't always have time or feel like doing. If somebody posts extensive information about something I've had my eye on, I think it's great - saves me time and energy hunting the information down. I love now having the information about the shimmer paints - that it's a product I can get elsewhere in TONS of colors. Do I feel that SU or whatever company should feel obligated to have that information available to consumers, no, but I sure love companies that do and am more likely to purchase from them.

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Old 01-05-2010, 06:27 AM   #13
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Sorry if you thought that I was implying that you thought is was the sellers responsiblitiy ... I was just stating.

By "research" I am referring to you putting the information together. You saw it in the mini and knew you saw it somewhere else.

"Do I feel that SU or whatever company should feel obligated to have that information available to consumers, no, but I sure love companies that do and am more likely to purchase from them." (I totally agree)

I also dont know if the guide lists the product as Tsukineko, but it is labeled on the product.

If in the gallery it says Shimmer paint ... yeah I would not know where that came from.
If the person bought it from SU and says SU Shimmer paint... much better IMO.

I do not think it is anything about taking props away from Tsukineko (not saying that is what you are saying)... just that SU decided to name it something else and that is what name ppl are using.


Also.. Interesting about the punch...
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Old 01-05-2010, 06:27 AM   #14
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Well, really does SU make anything? Maybe some stamps, but truly, they have to outsource almost everything. I think I see them as the "front man" for the best products (in their opinion). It is nice to know that the maker of their markers is the same as one I already have otherwise what a disappointment when I purchase them only to find out I have them!

IMO they should label clearly who makes the product. I was kind of shocked to see the better edge punch for a single punch I bought through SU at Michael's. I gave the smaller SU one away and was kind'a miffed that EK Success was not an exclusive to SU...just like Sizzix is not. I can find very similar or exact dies on line. It was marketed to me that way and that is simply not a true statement.

And, that is my fault for not being a cautious consumer. I am now. I only buy the products I cannot find anywhere else and if the price is better on those I can find.
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Old 01-05-2010, 06:45 AM   #15
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[QUOTE=53queenbee;15828470] EK Success was not an exclusive to SU...just like Sizzix is not. I can find very similar or exact dies on line. It was marketed to me that way and that is simply not a true statement.
[QUOTE]
Tsk Tsk to the person that told you that. There are some dies that are SU exclusive few folders and some other things.


"IMO they should label clearly who makes the product." Like in the catalog? I may agree (as a customer) but that (IMO) would not be good business practices. I think the only things that would sold would be what they manufacture themself ... so umm stamps? ::chuckle::
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:15 AM   #16
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Quote:

Originally Posted by geogymnast82View Post
I for one think it's incredibly helpful to know if a product is exclusive to a particular group or if it can be purchased elsewhere (and maybe in a bigger variety). If you haven't already purchased that product but are interested in it, but have had issues with the company who's listed here as getting credit for it being "their product", then you might miss out entirely on a great item. It's also nice to know who originally manufactures a product because a lot of times, you can get that same product elsewhere for less money. In my area, quality craft stores are basically non-existant and forget about a LSS, so already knowing that this product was available elsewhere isn't always obvious. I'd seen some techniques using the shimmer paints that I thought would be neat to try, but didn't particularly want to order from SU and didn't want those colors. Now that I know Tsukineko makes it, I can look elsewhere with a manufacturer name. I happen to like Tsukineko quality overall. Having the manufacturer's name is incredibly helpful if you haven't ordered the product before and have no other reference otherthan you can purchase it from SU. In this case, you might think that it's only available thru SU and only in those three colors. By getting the full story, it opens up a whole entire rainbow of color choices!

I'd like to thank meluvstampin for posting this. Since I hadn't purchased this product but was interested in it, I now know the name of who makes it, so I can search elsewhere for it in colors I want. Without this post, I probably wouldn't have asked lots of questions about the product (would take more time than I'd be interested in putting in) just to get info on it. Again, that you for posting!

THANK YOU SO MUCH for understanding where I am coming from.
I really appreciate this.
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Old 01-05-2010, 07:44 AM   #17
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I think it is easier to type "SU Shimmer Paint" versus having to google the spelling for "Tsukineko". lol JMO
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Old 01-05-2010, 09:11 AM   #18
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Quote:

Originally Posted by KalonismommyView Post
"IMO they should label clearly who makes the product." Like in the catalog? I may agree (as a customer) but that (IMO) would not be good business practices. I think the only things that would sold would be what they manufacture themself ... so umm stamps? ::chuckle::
It would be interesting to find out from a TAC demo what kind of sales volume they have on their accessory-type products. They sell quite a bit from other companies that they do not relabel - Pebbles Chalks, Scor-Pal, Lyra watercolor crayons, Bind-It-All, etc. They also carried the Big Shot several years before SU! started with their exclusive-colored one, although they don't carry that anymore. I always respected their choice to have transparency this way. And I suspect that they aren't losing out in that many sales because of it - a number of these items aren't carried by the big-box stores and many people find it quite convenient to have everything they need on one order.
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Old 01-05-2010, 10:21 AM   #19
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Quote:

Originally Posted by RonieView Post
I think it is easier to type "SU Shimmer Paint" versus having to google the spelling for "Tsukineko". lol JMO
ITA!!! I have trouble saying that company's name, let alone spelling it correctly!!
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Old 01-05-2010, 10:37 AM   #20
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Totally HOT Topic, so I am going to try to get my point across without adding more heat.

While I can certainly understand the passion in which the OP was written, there are some things that are just not feasible. For instance, if I buy a product from X company and open it, the packaging goes in the garbage. The product is used and I enter it on the information screen as X's product, but in fact it was made by Y company (a fact that is missing now that I threw the packaging away). Follow? That happens all the time.

Another example. I, personally, designed a stamp set for a company who is selling that stamp set under their label. I do NOT expect people to even know that, let alone put that information on their uploads/blogs/etc.

Final example. If I am designing for a company and the product I use, regardless of who makes it, is supplied by the company I am designing for, then the link will go to the company I am promoting. That is just the way things are done.

Now, do I *like* that this is the way it is? Well, no. I would love for the person who INVENTED shimmer paints to get full credit, just as I want credit when my designs are CASE'd in the gallery. Problem is, we don't live in a perfect world.

So, finally, to the OP... I'm glad you are passionate about this. I just wish there were a clear cut answer.
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Old 01-05-2010, 11:32 AM   #21
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I'm sure this is something that's already been hashed out and laid out in the written packaging/marketing agreement between Tsukineko and SU. So how are we to know exactly WHAT that agreement is... and who are we to question it? Is your beef mainly with stampers who are refering to it as "SU's" Shimmer paint? It doesn't look the least bit like SU's trying to "take credit" for Tsukineko's product... I highly doubt that SU's stepping all over Tsukineko's toes here. LOL Just my .02.

Edit for typo.
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Old 01-05-2010, 11:58 AM   #22
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I am not TALKING about packaging or about an agreement between companies. I am only stating it would be NICE FOR OTHER SCSers in our Galleries to know the name and for us to give credit.
SU wants demos to give credit to them for all of their cardstock/stamps and so on.
and that great great. But when this item is also sold and made by Tsukineko it would be nice for other SCSers to knwo that they can get it elsewhere and not think it is SU exclusive only.

Again a thread that got way blown up.
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Old 01-05-2010, 12:16 PM   #23
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BUT who's to say that X company making something for Y company hasn't made a miniscule change to the product for Y rendering it not totally 100% X company's product?
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Old 01-05-2010, 12:31 PM   #24
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Intersting thread thanks meluvstampin i just hope people just cool and think what the object in question was all about. This is something which happens to many companies who wish anothre respectable company to bring out a line of their own into their company.
Going back to the late nineties and early 2000 i sold Posh impressions wonderful exclusive coloured embossing powders around 2002, i still have some but Ranger industries made the product for Posh Impressions, on the label it said POSH IMPRESSIONS embossing powder not any sign of Ranger . But Dee Gruenig had her line of Inkabilities and Rainbow sponges made by RANGER so they became a product made by one manufacturer for another business just like all Dees wooden stamps were made initially by Rubber Stampede with posh Impressions name on but rubber stampedes name on the side of each stamp. Then Dee Gruenig had posh Impressions wood mounted stamps made by ALL NIGHT MEDIA which were later made by PLAID enterprises. But All Night Media was on the side of each stamp along with the name Posh impressions.
It seems that some companies but the company manufacturers name are on, and some dont and i understand why you are asking, because like the majority of STAMPIN UP they seem to have the majority made by other companies like E K SUCCESS who make the punches and initially Clearsnap who were once seperate made the rollagraph System and now its owned by Shellies husband Sterling so the product is Stampin around wheels and Inks and Handles clearsnap sort of Stampin Up.
This post could go on about many companies who make this and that but i agree all companies should put the initial companys name on the product in question. To finalize i guess the company who is having the product made want full credit and excellent sales so maybe thats why Suekeniko name is not on the bottle, strange though why is some things still suekeniko credit and sold like versamark pad for Stampin Up, i guess the name STAMPIN UP VERSAPAD would sound a bit strange.
Ah well the joys of crafting and the topics we discuss.
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Old 01-05-2010, 12:53 PM   #25
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Interesting, and I do get your point, sort of............. I think people may list it as such maybe if they bought it from SU, particularly if it was a demo uploading the card, because it's relatively "new" to the SU line. Or maybe if it were being uploaded as an SUO card.....

Myself, I'd probably just put "shimmer paint", like I would my crimper or paper trimmer, both made by Fiskars and carried by SU...... To me, it doesn't really make any difference though, but I think I do see where you are coming from........
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Old 01-05-2010, 06:23 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by galeView Post
I don't see why it's such a big deal *shrug*
Me neither.
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Old 01-05-2010, 06:30 PM   #27
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Is there a link for Tsu shimmer paint? I couldn't find it when I googled it.
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Old 01-05-2010, 06:44 PM   #28
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http://www.tsukineko.com/
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Old 01-05-2010, 08:34 PM   #29
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Mel I think the people that are posting it as SU SHimmer probably don't even know it is Tsukineko's product. I dont often read my labels that close, so I would assume many others dont either, although it certainly is nice to know who is originator.

I would assume it is cheaper than SU's also? Just curious on that. I always assumed SU made their own products, of course I never paid that much attention. I have come to note a lot of exclusive paper all comes from the same paper manufacturer.

But yes it is just like Kenmore is Sears brand, but it is also another well know manufacturer's product under a different name. They want you to think it is something special "their brand" when in fact the only difference is the name. And interesting topic for sure.
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Old 01-06-2010, 04:47 AM   #30
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hi,

If you want more info, email the person. You could ask in the comment box? If enough people want more info, the poster could reply to the email or the comment box. This happens all the time. I have done this, too.

I know that I will not look up every manufactor of each product I used. There are a lot of similar products and just because I like one, maybe you like a different type or my store only offers one.

My responsiblity is to fill out SCS's form as per their rules with the list of items used, not the store where I got it from, the cost of the item use, the manufactor of the item or each name the item could be listed under, now or 10 years ago or the name of the item in the USA and the different name in Canada and the name in England, etc.

A lot of people write "see my blog for list of items used, directions, ETC." If you can not get them to fill out the info correctly, you will not get them to list all possible names, possible places to buy, possible prices, alternative products, etc.

Once you get all people to fill out the SCS completely. . . .

No flames, please, just my 2 cents worth and not even worth that much.

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Old 01-06-2010, 07:43 AM   #31
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Betty_S_KView Post
If you want more info, email the person. You could ask in the comment box? If enough people want more info, the poster could reply to the email or the comment box. This happens all the time. I have done this, too.

I know that I will not look up every manufactor of each product I used. There are a lot of similar products and just because I like one, maybe you like a different type or my store only offers one.

My responsiblity is to fill out SCS's form as per their rules with the list of items used, not the store where I got it from, the cost of the item use, the manufactor of the item or each name the item could be listed under, now or 10 years ago or the name of the item in the USA and the different name in Canada and the name in England, etc.

A lot of people write "see my blog for list of items used, directions, ETC." If you can not get them to fill out the info correctly, you will not get them to list all possible names, possible places to buy, possible prices, alternative products, etc.

Once you get all people to fill out the SCS completely. . . .

No flames, please, just my 2 cents worth and not even worth that much.

Betty
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Old 01-06-2010, 01:29 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by ceramicat1View Post
Is there a link for Tsu shimmer paint? I couldn't find it when I googled it.
Scroll down to the Mettalics -
These sell for $3.76 each here

http://www.softexpressions.com/softw...pInk2.php#ink2
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Old 01-06-2010, 01:56 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by ToyView Post
Another example. I, personally, designed a stamp set for a company who is selling that stamp set under their label. I do NOT expect people to even know that, let alone put that information on their uploads/blogs/etc.
Small hijack:
Would you mind sharing a link to the stamp set that you designed?
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Old 01-06-2010, 02:47 PM   #34
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Quote:

Originally Posted by meluvstampinView Post
Scroll down to the Mettalics -
These sell for $3.76 each here

http://www.softexpressions.com/softw...pInk2.php#ink2
I have no problem with giving the manufacturer credit. However calling these Tsukineko Shimmer paints is also a misnomer. Tsukineko calls them all purpose inks. When I first went to their web site I couldn't find them because I was looking for shimmer paint, which appears to be the SU name.

I am glad to know there are more colors, not sure if I would ever buy them.
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