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I have watched, week after week after week, while techniques published in the Technique Junkies Newsletter get posted here on SCS only a day or so after they get printed. I have often wondered if the people who are doing this, and SCS who most CERTAINLY knows where they are coming from ever feel in the least bit guilty?
This is the most blatant stealing I've seen. A person could say that nobody "owns" a technique I suppose. But come on people!! Every single issue of TJN has the techniques appear here on SCS almost IMMEDIATELY after it is published. There is no way that is circumstantial, no way!
Can't you stand on your own feet here at SCS without taking something for which you have not given any compensation whatsoever?? Aren't you the least bit ashamed of your tactics??
What can you say? I doubt my note will get printed here, after all, this is theft I am talking about. Too bad that SCS is running their own reputation into the ground, even worse....you, the members are letting yourselves be accomplices by not standing up for something that is totally and completely wrong, to say nothing of illegal.
I am not ashamed to sign my name, after all it is not me who is stealing is it?
Connie Piotter aka sodakstamper
Welcome to SCS, the place where we do lots of sharing what we love!
I, for one, am very thankful for what is offered here at SCS..............since before just now, I've never even heard of TJN.
I guess since I've never heard of them, I don't really even know how to respond to you...........
Do they post them for people to use, but advise against sharing it with others? Do you have to register, and then digitally sign a contract in regards to not using the tutorials elsewhere? Are you condemned to silence after you've seen a tutorial?
Or is the basis there the same as it is here...............to share new things with others?
I guess this probably sounds snarky, but I would have put a lot more thought into a nicer response, had the OP been a bit more questioning rather than accusatory of SCS.
I have watched, week after week after week, while techniques published in the Technique Junkies Newsletter get posted here on SCS only a day or so after they get printed. I have often wondered if the people who are doing this, and SCS who most CERTAINLY knows where they are coming from ever feel in the least bit guilty?
This is the most blatant stealing I've seen. A person could say that nobody "owns" a technique I suppose. But come on people!! Every single issue of TJN has the techniques appear here on SCS almost IMMEDIATELY after it is published. There is no way that is circumstantial, no way! Can't you stand on your own feet here at SCS without taking something for which you have not given any compensation whatsoever?? Aren't you the least bit ashamed of your tactics??
What can you say? I doubt my note will get printed here, after all, this is theft I am talking about. Too bad that SCS is running their own reputation into the ground, even worse....you, the members are letting yourselves be accomplices by not standing up for something that is totally and completely wrong, to say nothing of illegal.
I am not ashamed to sign my name, after all it is not me who is stealing is it?
Connie Piotter aka sodakstamper
Sorry you are so upset~
SCS has *wonderful* tutorials they put on each week, on their own feet.
I hope you realize SCS can't be responsible for what it's members are doing with regards to sharing. I don't get the newsletter, so I am not sure what is from there and what isn't.
I am sure if they were aware of such blatant theft, they would be handling it.
Welcome to SCS, the place where we do lots of sharing what we love!
I, for one, am very thankful for what is offered here at SCS..............since before just now, I've never even heard of TJN.
I guess since I've never heard of them, I don't really even know how to respond to you...........
Do they post them for people to use, but advise against sharing it with others? Do you have to register, and then digitally sign a contract in regards to not using the tutorials elsewhere? Are you condemned to silence after you've seen a tutorial?
Or is the basis there the same as it is here...............to share new things with others?
I guess this probably sounds snarky, but I would have put a lot more thought into a nicer response, had the OP been a bit more questioning rather than accusatory of SCS.
I agree with the person in the quote.
Also, what the @@%#$# is tnj?
Someone really has nothing to do. Get up and get buusy lady! You need to!!
Technique Junkie is a newsletter that is a paid subscription thing. I don't subscribe but I've looked into it before.
If the SCS techniques are really the same ones right after, Like TJN hits on Monday then Wednesday the SCS one comes out and it's the same week after week, that's pretty odd. But still, I am under the impression that it takes some days to get those tutorials SCS does up and photographed and onto the site and all...
Anyhow if it's just that the same techniques are on TJN that are on SCS then, well duh! There are only so many techniques. Nothing is really all that new. It just gets a fresh turn in the spotlight.
Also, you do realize that you are hating on "our" site to "us" right? You didn't expect people to take that well did you? I don't have any idea what is currently featured on TJN so I don't feel like an "accomplice" at all.
hugs,
e
__________________ My BlogMy GalleryAll dog's feet smell like Fritos. I know you don't believe me, go check... See, I told you so.
I still maintain that all the techniques go around and around anyhow so I'm not sure it's bad. And also that if the SCS people really are using Technique Junkie as thier guide that's a little sketchy.
__________________ My BlogMy GalleryAll dog's feet smell like Fritos. I know you don't believe me, go check... See, I told you so.
ps, Shanon where's that popcorn smilie? I think we might need some.
Yeah, I was quite surprised to see it missing from her post.
Also, I just saw the other thread about TJN here in the general stamping forum, (weird how I've never heard of them and then *poof*, two threads in a day), and noticed one person mentioned that this weeks Weekly Inkling was a tutorial from TJN from October. That's hardly immediate.
This was posted in the tutorial comments. I wanted to make sure it's seen here, too.
Quote:
Hi all, it would never be our attempt to publish, without consent, material that's been published elsewhere. We'll look into this and do the right thing. I won't say anything other than that until we get a better understanding of the facts.
Thanks, and if you can, please try and refrain from further back and forth about this in the comments.
Daven | Wed Jun 4, 2008 at 2:01 PM
While there are alot of great techniques here to try, I think that you are a bit over zealous in your theft comments, considering I have thought about subsscribing the the newsletter and if you really look you will see that there are way more techniques listed in her list since she started it than there are on here, so I think maybe taking a step back and chilling out a bit would help. I really don't see where theft is the issue, but maybe that is just me?
I am a subscribing to Technique Junkies and I have been for several years. I will admit to not using many of them because the techniques call for things I just don't own and I'm not good at figuring out what is a great substitute. I just got my new issue yesterday and it has some fun stuff in there.
I joined because a few years ago a SCS member posted a great card in her gallery and when people asked how she did it, she referred them to Technique Junkies, so I subscribed.
I won't comment on the OP's accusations as I just have no clue. I don't see the stuff from this issue on the resource page except for one technique that has been on SCS for months and months.
I do agree, that most things come around, but I will tell you, some of the stuff in the newsletter, I have never seen before. Pat and her team put together some great ideas.
As a person who has contributed techniques to Technique Junkies (http://patstamps.com), I can only tell you what Pat has said about sharing techniques:
"I don't own the techniques, I only own the words."
It's the written description of the technique that Pat has copyrighted. She can't copyright the techniques themselves.
For those of us who contribute, yes, some of them are techniques we came up with all by ourselves. Others are ones we learned somewhere else and let Pat know about. Even the ones that I came up with all by myself may have been done before, I simply do not know. I am just the first person to give it a name and submit it to Technique Junkies.
As long as people are not cutting and pasting the directions from the TJ newsletter or the tutorials on the TJ site, they are not doing anything wrong with sharing them up here as long as they are using their own words to describe them. Of course, people who subscribe to TJ know that Pat loves it when you give a shout out to TJ when you share a card using a technique you learned from it and really, it is only polite to do so. And it would be nice to simply direct people to the patstamps.com site when they ask where you learned the technique, especially for those techniques that came out recently. However, sharing the techniques with others is not considered "stealing" as long as you use your own words to describe them.
'Nuff said. But for those who were wishing for this:
Connie, a few thoughts that come to mind:
1. It appears the TJN editor is an SU demo so I would think she is quite aware of SCS and if there was a problem with techniques being posted she would have contacted them before now.
2. I don't see copyrighting notices on her website regarding the techniques.
3. Do you know for a fact she has created every technique shown on her site or is it possible she has learned them from, oh let's say, SU website or monthly publications, or paper crafting publications? Just a thought......
4. Some of the girls you are calling thieves seem to have hearts the size of Texas so I think you've stepped waaaaay over your boundaries with such blatant assumption.
5. And last: You've been lurking for TWO years and decided that this should be your first post :confused: Wow, my friend. :( I find that really sad.
I have never subscribed to TJN so I can't say if something is lifted. BUT I haven't joined because I didn't want to pay when I could get tutorials on SCS for free.
I have never subscribed to TJN so I can't say if something is lifted. BUT I haven't joined because I didn't want to pay when I could get tutorials on SCS for free.
*the above is quoted from the last posting*
and that is exactly what I am upset about. TJN is a paid subscription newsletter and someone (or the brass at SCS) is taking it and passing it off here for free. Someone said techs aren't "owned" but wouldn't you be upset if someone or a website took ideas you had worked hard to accumulate and publish and gave them away for free to others and passed it off as their own?
It's just totally wrong, morally wrong and borders on stealing from a paid publication. Perhaps Pat has printed a lot of techs, perhaps she didn't "invent" them all herself, however doesn't it strike anyone that as soon as the latest issue of TJN comes out....there are several of the latest TJN techniques sitting on center stage at SCS.....hhmmmm coincidence? I think not! Every time it happens, every issue.
Think about that the next time you are enjoying a high-jacked technique on SCS for free.
Connie...this was posted by the OWNER of SCS.
Please take a moment to read it. Thanks, from a HUGE fan of Daven and SCS :mrgreen:
Hi all, it would never be our attempt to publish, without consent, material that's been published elsewhere. We'll look into this and do the right thing. I won't say anything other than that until we get a better understanding of the facts.
Thanks, and if you can, please try and refrain from further back and forth about this in the comments.
Daven | Wed Jun 4, 2008 at 2:01 PM
Hmmm, maybe I wasn't clear with what I said so I will say it this way:
I didn't want to pay for the TJN because I couldn't see many techniques or pictures, I believe right now they are showing 3 before you pay. Since I am not a new stamper I didn't know what it was I would be paying for that would be new to me.
If you are so upset about the possibility of stealing then have you brought it to the attention of TJN?
Quote:
Originally Posted by SodakStamper
I have never subscribed to TJN so I can't say if something is lifted. BUT I haven't joined because I didn't want to pay when I could get tutorials on SCS for free.
*the above is quoted from the last posting*
and that is exactly what I am upset about. TJN is a paid subscription newsletter and someone (or the brass at SCS) is taking it and passing it off here for free. Someone said techs aren't "owned" but wouldn't you be upset if someone or a website took ideas you had worked hard to accumulate and publish and gave them away for free to others and passed it off as their own?
It's just totally wrong, morally wrong and borders on stealing from a paid publication. Perhaps Pat has printed a lot of techs, perhaps she didn't "invent" them all herself, however doesn't it strike anyone that as soon as the latest issue of TJN comes out....there are several of the latest TJN techniques sitting on center stage at SCS.....hhmmmm coincidence? I think not! Every time it happens, every issue.
Think about that the next time you are enjoying a high-jacked technique on SCS for free.
I think 'thief' is a strong accusation...be very sure you have 'proof'! As it has been pointed out, unless the instructions are taken word for word no one can really own a technique unless they invent it themselves. Which I am sure is very rare. We are all inspired by other people's work and I am sure you yourself have seen an idea and expanded on it. So please relax, take a breather and don't be so quick to accuse.
As far as I know, isn't Pat an active member here??? I think she is well aware of SCS's happenings and I'm sure if she was concerned she would bring it to the attention of Daven. I'm also curious as to if the OP contacted TJN about her concerns.
let me start by saying Connie, you need to hang around here more. we've never used "it's critical of SCS" as the reason to delete or disallow a posting.
we've always had a good and positive relationship with Pat of Technique Junkies. Pat was one of our earliest newsletter advertisers as a matter of fact. if Pat has an issue with something we've published I'm sure she'll send us a note and we'll work it out.
other than that, I'll give you a little more info on how we select and publish our tutorials. Beate and guest authors write all our tutorials. Beate gets creative freedom to do what she wants, that's the first principle :^) we purposefully do *not* subscribe or look at Pat's newsletter, in order to avoid any question about borrowed language or inspiration.
Beate sets her own priorities about what gets published and what doesn't. oftentimes she'll respond to requests for a particular technique or project, other times she'll use popular tools or techniques to complete a project. and then other times it's just what she likes. Beate maintains a tutorial schedule months in advance, any timing similarities between our schedule and someone else's would most likely be a coincidence.
I can't speak to whether or not Claudia (this week's tutorial author) is a subscriber to TJN, her original text underwent significant editing after we received it so any resemblance or similar language between the tutorial published on SCS and any other versions elsewhere would again, have to be a coincidence.
the stamping world is pretty close-knit, at least the part of it that SCS inhabits. it would never be our intention to misuse material that someone else has published. returning to what I said at the outset, if a problem did exist I'm quite certain we'd receive a polite note from Pat and I'm equally certain that we'd resolve it in a friendly way.
After doing a little investigating, I believe Claudia when she says she got the directions from her SU! demonstrator. This technique was published in the October issue of TJ and it became circulated among demonstrators immediately after that. For instance:
This tutorial was published the same month as the TJ issue that the double pocket card appeared in. The publisher of this blog (who is not a member of the TJ yahoo group...I checked) says she got it from her friend Mary Ann.
So it seems like this project idea has been "out there", shared by someone who may have seen it in TJ, wrote their own tutorial (the above tutorial and the one on TJ are not alike) for a downline group or a class and it has gotten around from there.
Does anyone actually own a technique??? I don't see how you can steal something like that, they are ideas shared by all members. I for one am very thankful for SCS - wish I would have found this site alot sooner than I did! It is a wealth of information and ideas which we don't have to pay for!
A note for everyone at SCS - keep up the good work!
__________________ ...So many stamps...so little time!
well stated daven.
my 2 cents-just how many new ways are there to use stamps,paper and glue???????????
and as i believe... don't like something just move along!
I did get Pat's newsletter and it was awesome, but really didn't see any huge lifting of those techniques! Alot of techniques here can be found elsewhere on the web at so many various sites. It's too bad you never looked at her newsletter to subscribe, just give it a few months try and see for yourself. They are very unique and her examples are really pretty and beautiful.
well stated daven.
my 2 cents-just how many new ways are there to use stamps,paper and glue???????????
and as i believe... don't like something just move along!
Amen, and also, how many different ways can you say" score at blah blah blah, fold at blah blah blah" !! When did everyone on here get so mean and critical. People need to realize that there are enough problems in the world and that we shouldn't sweat the small stuff. I was taught a long time ago not to say anything if I didn't have anything nice to say, what happened to good old fashioned kindness?
mean and cruel seem to be a new trend. but thankfully by a few. and might i say by a few that seem to pop on and make a negative one at that.
connie why not have a galley and show us your original talents!
Location: Oh that poor carrot! It's been fondue'd!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JanTInk
After doing a little investigating, I believe Claudia when she says she got the directions from her SU! demonstrator. This technique was published in the October issue of TJ and it became circulated among demonstrators immediately after that. For instance:
This tutorial was published the same month as the TJ issue that the double pocket card appeared in. The publisher of this blog (who is not a member of the TJ yahoo group...I checked) says she got it from her friend Mary Ann.
So it seems like this project idea has been "out there", shared by someone who may have seen it in TJ, wrote their own tutorial (the above tutorial and the one on TJ are not alike) for a downline group or a class and it has gotten around from there.
This bolded part needs to be emphasized. Pat herself encourages us to share the techniques we subscribe to, as long as we change the wording if we're going to give written instructions. We cannot just copy and paste, but we CAN share. Thanks, Jan, for both of your posts explaining that...
So unless they were copied and pasted from TJN, and based on Daven's reply that would be an impossibility, then the accusations of "theft" are unfounded...
I am an "ultimate subscriber" to the newsletter, and I am on SCS nearly every waking moment ;). I love both sites. Many stampers share their TJN creations in the gallery here. It is the most centralized, widely viewed gallery on the internet. Sharing their creations here helps both SCS AND www.patstamps.com so I feel it's a win/win for everyone...
sorry you are upset and feel there is some underhandedness around, but as a member of both sites, I'm just not seeing it.
I do subscribe to the TJ newsletter and I also hang out here ever so often. I think in this particular case it all was an unlucky coincidence and not really anybodies fault in particular. I am just so sorry that Pat got terribly upset over this and I wish there was something I could do to help her. I am also sorry that the thread with the tutorial on SCS got so trashed.
This should be a reminder for ALL of us that when we print something out to ALWAYS put down the source where we got it. Never "accept" a tutorial or technique from a friend who got it "someplace else" if that friend can't tell you where it came from. I know I do freely distribute tutorials and techniques that I have written and I know that they are not from somewhere else cause they flooded out of my own convoluted brain ;) The "techniques" maybe be out there already, that I don't know, but if my inspiration came from a personal need or from my forest, I'm sure my wording will be different, hehe.
These things just happen if we hand down stuff and play tag, its is bound to end up somewhere where it could upset the originator of the ideas or words. Just try to keep track of your things and label them, quite easy to get used to.
__________________
currently designing for: Clear Artistic Stamps, Elemental Doodles and RubberRoadAdventures!
Stealing Techniques/Tutorials from TJN
What the !!!$$$#@#$
