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-   -   SU changes for demos (https://www.splitcoaststampers.com/forums/general-stamping-talk-f17/su-changes-demos-t456638.html)

Phantom 09-01-2009 10:04 AM

SU changes for demos
 
Okay... I'll stick my neck out.

Have you read this: http://paperlicious.typepad.com/paperlicious/ ?

What do you think?

StampinHappyInCT 09-01-2009 10:08 AM

I'm not a demo, and I read only *some* of the information in the link you provide and my first reaction was ... "Wow! SU! is being really restrictive!!!"

Do they actually "police" their policies on people's blogs, websites, etc.?

AGMommyof2 09-01-2009 10:16 AM

Just makes me feel that they no longer think their products are good enough to stand up to the competition! It's not like this is going to make people have money to spend! I liked buying SU cause I felt they offered some really good quality items ~ now um, makes me question that....

danibug 09-01-2009 10:18 AM

It will be interesting to see how this plays out...
I'm really quite shocked at how strict the new agreement is.

calgramma 09-01-2009 10:20 AM

I am an SU demo and what they are doing is no different than any other company with proprietary information and restrictions on 'competition'. If you work for Tupperware, you can't promote Rubbermaid, if you work for Avon, you can't promote Mary Kay....same thing!

vanislandwoman 09-01-2009 10:20 AM

Wow, one of those paragraphs sounds like it would prohibit SU demos from Splitcoast!

I'm going to edit out the quotation I had put here, since I didn't have permission to use it. But the concern was about if your choice of web community promotes or markets other craft companies.

What a can of worms!

Carol Lee 09-01-2009 10:22 AM

Seems like they are really trying to police people's personal lives. Just because I sold Pampered Chef didn't mean that I couldn't like other kitchen products as well.

babydal57 09-01-2009 10:23 AM

To me, it's sad. Many people on design teams will be forced to decided between one income and another. That's tough in this economy. :(

For me personally, it's most likely a good thing. I love SU products and will probably remain a customer. I have a teeny, tiny, itty, bitty problem with cardstock addiction, LOL~ And I have all that money invested in matching non-consumables like ink pads, spots, reinkers, markers, etc.

I think it'll be better for my wallet for me to be a customer rather than a demo. Those impulse midnight $150 orders KILL my budget. :oops:

AGMommyof2 09-01-2009 10:27 AM

[QUOTE=vanislandwoman;15029355]Wow, one of those paragraphs sounds like it would prohibit SU demos from Splitcoast!
Sounds like they can still come here & talk about SU ~ not sure if they are allowed to talk about anything else ~~ but I apparently they are not allowed to send anyone here to look at things...

Can you imagine ~ all those great examples in the Gallery (so nicely put into sets & alphabetized) all for nothing!?!

vanislandwoman 09-01-2009 10:29 AM

Oh, dear, you replied before I got the quote removed!

AGMommyof2 09-01-2009 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanislandwoman (Post 15029428)
Oh, dear, you replied before I got the quote removed!

I removed it ~ but not my comment...

steubner 09-01-2009 10:31 AM

Here's the thing. If I sell your product, great, it's in my best interest to only promote it. Otherwise I'm sending dollars to someone else. But to tell me what I can and can't say on Facebook? or Twitter? Or I can't link to my friend, when I say I went to visit her, because she's on a design team? That's totally ridiculous. If SU wants to pay for demos blogs or reimburse them for their time spent doing their PERSONAL HOBBY, then great, they can govern what you say and link to. But until then, it just rubs me the wrong way that they're trying. I'm a former demo, been gone for over a year. But I would resign today if I were still one.

Phantom 09-01-2009 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanislandwoman (Post 15029355)
Wow, one of those paragraphs sounds like it would prohibit SU demos from Splitcoast!

I'm going to edit out the quotation I had put here, since I didn't have permission to use it. But the concern was about if your choice of web community promotes or markets other craft companies.

What a can of worms!

I almost titled this thread "can of worms!" LOL!!

Later in that quote it also sounds like they are possibly going to have a "community" similar to SCS at some point. I can't tell from the wording if it would be for demos only or customers also. I'll withhold my opinion on that tidbit for when the time comes.

For the record, as the OP, here's my comment to Joan B's blog:

".....And now... SU. Why don't they just change the name to Big Brother? Oh.. they'd probably say "Big Sister." Goodness. Competition is a fact, so just suck it up and rise to the occasion for cryin' out loud. Embrace it even.

They said once that there's no such thing as "just a hobby demo." Well, yes there is, and I imagine only business demos will want to go along with this.

What bothers me most is the arrogance of the statement: "It is in your best interest, as well as the company's, to not allow competitive businesses to utilize the drawing power of Stampin' Up! to build revenue or find customers." Maybe ... some people are introduced to SU because of an initial interest in SOMETHING ELSE! Ya think?

Shudder... I understand the business argument and I see that they are protecting themselves. Again - just rise to the occasion. They can offer this as advice if they think it will improve their demos businesses -- but to require a signed agreement is just too much.

I'm glad I'm not a demo anymore. "

n5stamper 09-01-2009 10:34 AM

OMgosh and for Pete's sake, are they for real. My daughter is a SU demo. I am a DT member for 2 competetive companies. According to this new IDA she can not have my blog link on her blog site. What kind of CRAP is that. I guess she will probably drop her SU demo as well as a lot more will do and now I will not be able to purchase any SU products any longer either. This TOTALLY STINKS!

mrsjllove 09-01-2009 10:38 AM

Well, I can say that my final SU order was placed a few months ago. I won't be buying anymore SU products now that they've done this to their most loyal fans.

Now I'll be on the lookout to find a good source of dimensionals. :P

brooklynsmom 09-01-2009 10:41 AM

my question is.........how much can they really track all of this??

allee's 09-01-2009 10:43 AM

Looks to me like they have shot themselves in the foot and the wound could be fatal!
Very short sighted, IMHO!

AGMommyof2 09-01-2009 10:46 AM

I don't know why this makes me feel so strongly ~ but it does ~ I started out as so many at a SU demo party ~ & I found this site not thru her ~ but thru the internet ~ not searching SU but just stamping in general... but what kept me 'buying SU' was the face to face service of my demo & the quality of the products!!! WHen I moved ~ I did not find a SU demo who offered the 'love' for stamping & friendship thru stamp camps or make n takes ~ as much as the interest in $$ making thru parties ~ heck I knew no one here How was I supposed to host a party.... so, SU lost my business ~

Now they just appear to be another greedy money sucking company IMO... Monopolies generally aren't a good idea...

MikiBee 09-01-2009 10:48 AM

I can't see how this could be good for anyone. I can understand SU not wanting their demos to promote other products, but this is a bit over the top, imo. It's like telling a McDonald's employee that they can't be seen eating at KFC, or talking about ANY other kinds of foods to their friends. A little "Big Brother-ish."

So, does this mean the demos have to remove all the cards here on SCS from their gallery that have other products, other than SU, on them? Wow-- what a nightmare. And they have to remove links from their personal blogs to other's blogs that they like? Holy Cow!!

vanislandwoman 09-01-2009 10:51 AM

I do understand and support the need for a company to protect it's product lines. They all do it. It's part of business.

The problem for seller/consumers is that they are living in a world where cross-pollination of ideas is vital, it seems to me. Artists don't generally operate in little self-contained compartments. They take in what is around them and meld it into something new and unique.

In their community (eg Splitcoast as an example), this cross-pollination is the attraction. "What are you doing, with what, and how? So how about if I take your idea and mix it with my idea and come up with something new! Look at this, what do you think? "

"Oh, I can't show this collaboration to anyone because you used a competitor's products when you made yours and I sell SU! and can only promote SU! products. "

Ah well, I guess we'll just have to watch and see how it all plays out.

akstampmama 09-01-2009 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by n5stamper (Post 15029464)
OMgosh and for Pete's sake, are they for real. My daughter is a SU demo. I am a DT member for 2 competetive companies. According to this new IDA she can not have my blog link on her blog site. What kind of CRAP is that. I guess she will probably drop her SU demo as well as a lot more will do and now I will not be able to purchase any SU products any longer either. This TOTALLY STINKS!

Is she on a design team? Would you really ask your daughter to give up her business because she can't have your blog link on her blog? Seems like you may be overeacting a bit. I think people are getting a little worked up about this - especially those who are not demos. If this directy affects you and your business maybe you should be discussing it over on the demo side. Otherwise I'm not sure what point there is to this thread.

mothermars 09-01-2009 10:55 AM

I'm so glad I left the company two years ago. I smelled a corporate failure, and the scent is getting stronger. The world is so different from the home party business model SU was founded on. To not allow demonstrators to promote their creativity nor their businesses on websites like Facebook and Splitcoaststampers will cut off a huge source of interest and enthusiasm for their products. I'm much more interested in scrapbooking now that I have left the company, and frankly, there's nothing in the catalog that I would be interested in purchasing (especially at SU prices) except cardstock--and if I have to, I'll just switch to Bazzil.

tx stamper 09-01-2009 10:57 AM

yikes!
 
I am really sad about this and shocked like everyone else.
I am a "hobby" demo. It seems to me all the hobby demos will gladly find somewhere else to get their supplies in order to not be told what they can/cannot post or link on their PERSONAL blogs.

Seems to me SU will be losing A LOT of business by doing this.... I dont see how it protects the SU demoships at all! If SU goes down because of this, so will all their SU demos that they are trying to "protect" with this change of policy, wouldn't it? Just a thought!

akstampmama 09-01-2009 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mothermars (Post 15029647)
I'm so glad I left the company two years ago. I smelled a corporate failure, and the scent is getting stronger. The world is so different from the home party business model SU was founded on. To not allow demonstrators to promote their creativity nor their businesses on websites like Facebook and Splitcoaststampers will cut off a huge source of interest and enthusiasm for their products. I'm much more interested in scrapbooking now that I have left the company, and frankly, there's nothing in the catalog that I would be interested in purchasing (especially at SU prices) except cardstock--and if I have to, I'll just switch to Bazzil.

This is totally untrue. Did you read the agreement FAQ on the orginal post? Demonstrators can promote their businesses on websites like facebook and blogs. It says they can't promote other products or businesses on the internet. As far as SCS goes it may mean demos need to remove the SU demonstrator links from their signatures if they are going to post other companies products and they probably can't link their blog to SCS. If you are selling SU I don't think you would want to send your customers to look at competing products anyway.

AGMommyof2 09-01-2009 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by akstampmama (Post 15029635)
Is she on a design team? Would you really ask your daughter to give up her business because she can't have your blog link on her blog? Seems like you may be overeacting a bit. I think people are getting a little worked up about this - especially those who are not demos. If this directy affects you and your business maybe you should be discussing it over on the demo side. Otherwise I'm not sure what point there is to this thread.

I know it affects me & I am not a demo!!! Personally this should have been done with the new catty or at the 6 month point ~ isn't that when most Hostess Clubs begin/end!!!:(

Phantom 09-01-2009 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by akstampmama (Post 15029635)
Is she on a design team? Would you really ask your daughter to give up her business because she can't have your blog link on her blog? Seems like you may be overeacting a bit. I think people are getting a little worked up about this - especially those who are not demos. If this directy affects you and your business maybe you should be discussing it over on the demo side. Otherwise I'm not sure what point there is to this thread.

You have got to be kidding me.

small change 09-01-2009 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrsjllove (Post 15029509)
Well, I can say that my final SU order was placed a few months ago. I won't be buying anymore SU products now that they've done this to their most loyal fans.

Now I'll be on the lookout to find a good source of dimensionals. :P

Scroll down
http://confessionsofaribbonaddict.bl...icky-sale.html

AGMommyof2 09-01-2009 11:04 AM

I just wonder how much % wise ~ of SCS's gallery is SU? It sure is nice to be able to look up the SU set & get great ideas ~ why should SCS continue to promote SU like that if SU demos can't even send their customers here for inspiration...

It might be a nice change to see other companies sets organized as nicely...

Phantom 09-01-2009 11:08 AM

I've got to say that I discovered SCS through a friend/demo. I would have grown bored with SUOnly pretty quickly and SCS has kept me in stamping and buying SU. With the last SU catalog, I still earned level 2 hostess set. SCS has only enhanced my enjoyment of SU products. It's where I come to see samples with their latest stamps. Too bad the bloggers can't link it on their PERSONAL blogs.

Anyone else like the movie, You've Got Mail? Ask Kathleen Kelly -- it's not just business; it is personal!!

brooklynsmom 09-01-2009 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AGMommyof2 (Post 15029727)
I just wonder how much % wise ~ of SCS's gallery is SU? It sure is nice to be able to look up the SU set & get great ideas ~ why should SCS continue to promote SU like that if SU demos can't even send their customers here for inspiration...

It might be a nice change to see other companies sets organized as nicely...

i totally agree! You can do a lot of different cards/projects using things other than stampin up! only. Hobby Demos are going to start dropping like flies if they feel as if they are not "allowed" to use or discuss any other products besides Stampin Up! As for me, i just stocked up on cardstock and re-inkers, because i know demos that are outraged! (my 2 cents, anyway)

Phantom 09-01-2009 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by small change (Post 15029705)

Thanks for that!! It's bookmarked. I've come across Jody's page before and totally forgot whose it was :) .

lapom 09-01-2009 11:10 AM

I feel sad about this. I am not a demo, but I was contemplating the pros and cons of becoming one - probably hobby demo. I totally understand promoting the company you demo for and use their products. If one doesn't, then it really doesn't say too much for the company. OK, here is my however...if a demo uses a product that SU does not even sell - such as Scor-Pal - how would SU lose any business over that? I can see where the other side of that argument would be - SU has bone folders to make folds with. OK, here is another however... I personally would not attempt to fold a 3-D papercrafting project with a ruler and a bone folder. I am one of those who can't draw a straight line with a ruler, so you could just imagine how that would turn out!

steubner 09-01-2009 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phantom (Post 15029702)
You have got to be kidding me.

Thanks, Nancy, I was thinking the same thing, but wondering if I was alone. I totally feel like this affects me. I spend my hard earned money on craft supplies, and have spent a lot with SU. How they treat their "employees" or independent contractors definitely is a factor in where I spend my dollars.

vanislandwoman 09-01-2009 11:13 AM

The reason they are doing this is "to restrict marketing, promoting and selling of competitive products only."

If you are a demo, including a link to a competitive company via your website, blog, facebook entry etc is one problem they are trying to solve. I wonder if their solution will work.

If you are *not* a demo, you would be affected if a demo has to remove links to you. And if you benefit from a that competitor's link to you, that is what SU! is trying to do to protect their demos. But, as I tried to communicate in my earlier post, that is the problem in this intertwined communication world of ours.

Well, I better shut up about this now. I am not a demo for quite a while now, so it's probably NOMB.

akstampmama 09-01-2009 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phantom (Post 15029702)
You have got to be kidding me.

Nope I am serious. This seems to be another thread to stir up controversy about SU. The policy affects demonstrators and the customers of those demos who may choose to drop because of it. Unless you are a customer who has first hand knowledge that your demo is quitting I think you are getting upset for nothing. If you are a demonstrator or were thinking of becoming one then you will need to evaluate the policy and see if you can live with it or not.

brooklynsmom 09-01-2009 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by akstampmama (Post 15029810)
Nope I am serious. This seems to be another thread to stir up controversy about SU. The policy affects demonstrators and the customers of those demos who may choose to drop because of it. Unless you are a customer who has first hand knowledge that your demo is quitting I think you are getting upset for nothing. If you are a demonstrator or were thinking of becoming one then you will need to evaluate the policy and see if you can live with it or not.

sorry, its still too Big Brother for many demos that i happen to know!

Phantom 09-01-2009 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by small change (Post 15029705)

Thanks for that!! It's bookmarked. I've come across Jody's page before and totally forgot whose it was :) .

mrsjllove 09-01-2009 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by small change (Post 15029705)

Thanks! Just ordered a bunch. :D

rj77 09-01-2009 11:24 AM

That is very interesting. I think that they will end up hurting themselves more than helping. I don't see telling someone they can't link to a friend's blog if the friend sells for or promotes/designs for companies in addition to SU!

mothermars 09-01-2009 11:28 AM

Part of the point of this thread is that many of us speaking out are former SU demonstrators who are frustrated and disappointed with the changes we are seeing in a company we once loved, lived, and breathed. We were good at what we did. We followed every corporate policy to the letter. We promoted SU products and only SU products through SU-approved avenues at a time when we knew we were the best on the market, when the only place to get stamping and scrapbooking supplies for many people was through a SU demonstrator. That has changed.

Yes, SU still has some of the best products on the stamping market, but they do not have the best products on the scrapbooking market, and they certainly are not the only source for stamping and scrapbooking. Yet SU is still requiring its demonstrators to behave as if SU is the only company, to continue to ignore comments customers make in classes about a new product SU doesn't carry or about a product SU carries at a higher price than every craft store. SU is not reacting to the current market, economy, nor online community as quickly nor as well as other companies.


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