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Old 09-09-2004, 02:22 PM   #1
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Default No credit given!

A fellow Splitcoaster PM'd me to tell me that she had seen my work on another site, but that I had not been identified as the designer. I checked it out, and, sure enough, I found at least three of my cards and the work of several other SCS members! Only a few had been credited, and those had been watermarked by the designers. I E-mailed the site's creator stating my concerns.
I've included the link so that others could check it out for themselves. Does anyone know if she is a SCS member?
http://www.jenniferpeters.net
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Old 09-09-2004, 02:35 PM   #2
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OMG ~ Beate's work is all over that site and I believe I saw a creation or two of Jan's. That's so not right for people to do that. I mean, I know it's technically SU's property, but this gal appears to be claiming it for her own. At least when we post our work here, we have our own galleries and we aren't trying to get business or use this place as a business site. Someone should report this person to SU since it's bordering on being against the demo agreement ~ kind of in the gray area so I'm not sure if they've violated anything or not.
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Old 09-09-2004, 02:40 PM   #3
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Unfortunately, Stampin' Up! has made it their policy to let demos use anybody's work on their websites. They do not need to ask permission. They do not need to give the creator credit.
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Old 09-09-2004, 02:40 PM   #4
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Julie HRR is there too (all the best).....maybe she got permission from some to use the work??
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Old 09-09-2004, 02:41 PM   #5
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Even a non-SU website. She has a demo website, but this is a website that does not have stampinup.net in the address.
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Old 09-09-2004, 02:45 PM   #6
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Did you try emailing her? Maybe someone CASED you and then sbumitted it to her......hmmmm...............
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Old 09-09-2004, 02:46 PM   #7
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I just think its HILARIOUS that she picked one of my DH's cards! teehee
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Old 09-09-2004, 02:46 PM   #8
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Actually if you look further down the page, you'll see an Ebay Stores link. In her Ebay Store she is selling premade scrapbooks that use SU! stamps and papers. That's a violation in and of itself.

I didn't see any of my work, but with my dial-up connection her site loads so slowly I didn't have to patience to look far. What of mine did you see up there?
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Old 09-09-2004, 02:48 PM   #9
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Rebecca
I also saw your DH work!!! That is too funny - I guess that she did not get his permission huh!!!
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Old 09-09-2004, 02:49 PM   #10
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I don't agree with her taking credit for other people's art. But posting her website can effect her business...especially if her customers are SCS members.

She may be innocent and is just posting good ideas and didn't really think anything about it or she very well may be trying to take credit for other people's artwork and should be told that that is wrong...but now she is embarressed in front of her peers and customers that may be SCS members. I don't necessarily think posting her address was the right way to approach it.

Just my 2 cents.
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Old 09-09-2004, 02:51 PM   #11
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I just went on there, went into my first stamp set gallery and low and behold.....Mine was the first one! Granted I do considere it a form of flattery that she liked my card that much, but she should definitely give credit where credit is due.

I know SU gave us permission to show other's cards on our sites, but I just can't bring myself to do it! I want my customers to know what I'm creating. I give credit at my shows that others came up with the ideas if I demo it, but on your own website, unless you give the credit where credit is due, only put your own creations on there.
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Old 09-09-2004, 02:51 PM   #12
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Quote:

Originally Posted by JanTInk
Actually if you look further down the page, you'll see an Ebay Stores link. In her Ebay Store she is selling premade scrapbooks that use SU! stamps and papers. That's a violation in and of itself.

I didn't see any of my work, but with my dial-up connection her site loads so slowly I didn't have to patience to look far. What of mine did you see up there?
Jan ~ I thought I saw one of your Clarence cards in her Summer Mini section. Maybe I was wrong.
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Old 09-09-2004, 02:52 PM   #13
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she is using the exact photos....I checked one with fibers and they are exactly the same!
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Old 09-09-2004, 02:52 PM   #14
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Jan I have not seen yours yet but I found Mary Brown's and Julie HHR and some others that I just cant remember who they belonged to.

I am not sure what the "rules" are in "using" others work but I would think she should have contacted each person involved before copying to her website at the least....
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Old 09-09-2004, 02:58 PM   #15
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Jovi said, "Did you try emailing her? Maybe someone CASED you and then sbumitted it to her......hmmmm..............."
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No, they weren't cased.... they were definitely my originals. Yes, I did E-mail her, and I'll post again if I hear from her. I'm interested in what she has to say. If she got them from this site, there's no excuse not to give credit. All she had to do is what Lori Lynn did when she wanted to include my work on her site. She sent me a PM asking if I'd mind. Of course I said "yes"... it's very flattering when people like your work, but it's nice to be recognized!
And as for publishing her link, I thought others had a right to know that their work was being used. It was not meant to be malicious, just informational.
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Old 09-09-2004, 03:06 PM   #16
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What I got when I called was "you can use other's art on your SU Demo website." That's all. Not on personal sites that are business tools that aren't purchased from SU.
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Old 09-09-2004, 03:07 PM   #17
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The Crayon Resist Jest Between Friends is not mine, it is Beate's! I recognized it immediately, since it inspired my own crayon resist Clarence card.

SOmeone should at least tell her to: a) dither the photos so they load faster and b) to put a new copyright at the bottom. Some of those stamp sets are from 2003 or 2004, but she still has copyright 1998-2001 below every photo.
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Old 09-09-2004, 03:11 PM   #18
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I don't know y'all that well yet, and I certainly couldn't go to a website and say -- "hey, that's so and so's card!" You are amazing in that regard. Anyway, under the snowflakes stamp set section, she definitely has people's names under their cards. Still don't know if she has permission, just observing.

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Old 09-09-2004, 03:13 PM   #19
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Just noticed at the top of the gallery it's says something about thanks for stopping and e-mail her if you want your card included.

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Old 09-09-2004, 03:14 PM   #20
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I called DS and they said that she is not in compliance and they are on it. You actually can't use other people’s cards unless you get them off stampers showcase and it is in a SU website! The eBay store also is a major no no.......so....we will see what happens.

Should I be offended that none of my cards are on there! LOL!!!!
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Old 09-09-2004, 03:21 PM   #21
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Leese ~ you are braver than me. I was too afraid of the karmic repurcussions to actually rat her out. I am glad they are on it. Wonder if we should call Mary Kay and rat on her with them too ~ she has all kinds of MK products on her EBay store too.
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Old 09-09-2004, 03:23 PM   #22
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Lisa Lisa
Should I be offended that none of my cards are on there! LOL!!!!
Hahahahahahahha!!!

We can be offended together!

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Old 09-09-2004, 03:24 PM   #23
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Hey Lisa, maybe we can congratulate ourselves. Our creations are so awesome, so stupendous, that she did not dare to put them on her site for fear of making all the other cards look bad? But then, Beate's stuff is all over it and I definitely would not outshine her any day of the week! So my theory is bunk, but it is a nice thought.
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Old 09-09-2004, 03:27 PM   #24
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I don't think you really have to worry about karmic reprocussions unless you do something with bad intent. Standing up for your rights and your artwork is not malicious. She should have asked permission or used her own stuff! Good for you for calling DS!

(my 2cents worth)
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Old 09-09-2004, 03:27 PM   #25
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I am sure my opinion will be in the minority here (so no flames please! LOL) but I think some times we make a just a TEENY bit too big of a deal about the whole casing thing. When you put your work on the internet, you do so knowing that anyone can see it, copy it, right click and save it, whatever. There is nothing on here (at least that I've seen) that says that work cannot be copied. I look on here a lot for ideas and I've never (at least not to my knowledge) copied someone's card in it's entirety. At the same time, I'm not about to come on here and search through all of the cards just to make sure mine doesn't look similar to someone else's card so I can give credit.

Some people (not necessarily on this board) have gone to an extreme giving credit to people...."I cased this color combination from (whomever)" etc. I mean think about how ridiculous it would be to have to say...."I cased the color combination from Sue but added mint melody because I saw that from Jane so I guess really I cased it from Jane. I cased the position of the flower and layering the cardstock from Shellie and I cased the kind of bow I made from Jessica. Embossing the saying on the card was cased from Robin...." I'd just rather not post anything than to risk getting everyone in an uproar because I didn't realize mine was similar to another person's card.

I realize she actually posted these cards to her site. And with the exception of the few that listed names, it does make it appear that it is her work. But the fact is that in all likelihood, it's people in her area or her customers who are going to this site - or at least that's the ones who will buy from her. So it's not like she's stealing your customers. Even if your name was there, what benefit would it have to you? It's not like she's going to link to your site so her customers can order from you.

Consider it flattery that she thought enough of her work to post it to her site to show what the BEST can do with SU products.

Just my two cents....
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Old 09-09-2004, 03:32 PM   #26
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True, but at the same time, she didn't CASE, she used originals that weren't hers. In any industry, that is considered copyright infringment. Granted that the copyright to these products are SU, but we all work hard to come up with original outwork, and no one should use our work without giving us credit. If she would have just used other people's samples and made her own, that would be different....
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Old 09-09-2004, 03:33 PM   #27
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original outwork

I'm getting ahead of myself, I meant original artwork
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Old 09-09-2004, 03:38 PM   #28
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Definitely one good thing is she's uploaded to her own server and isn't parcing from ours. That would be completely uncool.

I've cased other's works ~ changed little things and given credit when I did, but what she's done is the equivelant to scanning a card she received in a swap and claiming she did the work. Not cool and fortunately against SU policy.
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Old 09-09-2004, 03:40 PM   #29
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I have had a few people ask if they can post my work on their website, one of whom was Lori Lynn, who asked me once and has proceeded to copy pictures with wild abandon without asking me again. HOWEVER, she always does put my name under the card; I have, in fact, a gallery up on her site of just my stuff. Technically, she should ask each and every time, but since she credits me and I am in good company on her site, I have not really minded.

I have also had a new demo approach me and ask to put nothing BUT my art up on their SU! demo website art gallery. She asked nicely and I said I didn't think it was a good idea. Your demo website should be about YOUR creativity, not mine. In a pinch, you can use Stamper's Showcase images and the demos who submit their work do give up their rights to the copyright of their work when they send it in to SU!, so technically, they can grant the use of the image of the work to whom they please.

But, an art gallery intended for one's customers should really be all about your creativity, IMHO. I certainly have CASEd my share of cards, even ones that I post to my website, but I always acknowledge in some way the person whose idea was the jumping off part for mine, even if I don't remember their name. So while, one or two images of cards copied (with permission) from another person's gallery or from here is okay, you certainly should feature your own work on your own site. Just my 2 cents.
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Old 09-09-2004, 03:45 PM   #30
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Quote:

Originally Posted by Lisa Lisa

Should I be offended that none of my cards are on there! LOL!!!!
My thoughts exactly....Its upsetting to know that apparently this lady likes Rebecca's husbands cards better than mine! JUST KIDDING
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Old 09-09-2004, 03:47 PM   #31
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OMG.... there are several of my cards on there too! WOW...... not that I mind, I share scans of my cards with a couple demo's for their sites, but they always ask for permission. And, I also do the same..... I even get permission for people who send me RAK's before I post them on my site, AND, I make sure their name is on it giving them credit. My cards have the copyright info on them, along with my name, but it still standard to ask permission before "taking" it. Maybe she doesn't know? It will be interesting to find out if she responds to Happy Heart. I too, recognized many artists from here. It could just be an innocent mistake..........

I really hope she removes the cards she didn't get permission from or at least tries to get permission in the future.

Someone has a sharp eye!!
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Old 09-09-2004, 03:50 PM   #32
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Looks like I'm also in the minority here. When I looked at her site, it didn't look like she was taking credit for them, just posting examples. Perhaps somebody whose card is on her site could send her a friendly request to include a header that says the cards aren't all hers?

It's easy enough to avoid - just include your name along with the SU copyright notice. I'm not defending anyone who takes credit for others' work, but reposting non-copyrighted material doesn't seem as bad as to me some folks seem to think. Reminds me of a site I saw: Why you should never put your picture on the Internet:

http://www.searchbunny.com/why-you-n...picure-online/

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Old 09-09-2004, 03:55 PM   #33
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Marsha,

Now that was hilarious!!! Sorry..I really have nothing to say on this particular topic, but really...when has that ever stopped me. I did go to the site and was sort of hoping to see one of my cards on there, but alas..I did not. Thats okay, though....I am sure there is someone out there with a website full of Brownee-riginals.
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Old 09-09-2004, 03:55 PM   #34
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savanahstamper said, "So it's not like she's stealing your customers. Even if your name was there, what benefit would it have to you? It's not like she's going to link to your site so her customers can order from you."

I'm not a demonstrator, so I'm certainly not worried that she'll take business from me! However, I put a great deal of thought and effort into my cards, and enjoy the feed-back when people see my work...that's why I post my cards. I never mind if people CASE my work. In fact, I've always encouraged it, but these were not CASE'd cards. They were uploads of my actual cards.
That said, I would never take credit for someone else's designs, so it bugs me when someone does it to me!
I never intended for her to be reported, though. I think that 's a bit harsh, since we don't know what her true intentions were. It could be that she was just clueless and didn't mean anything devious by it.
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Old 09-09-2004, 04:01 PM   #35
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It is my understanding that, anything put on the internet becomes public domain. Legally, we don't have any recourse.

SU! specifically granted demonstrators permission to download and paste photos from the Stamper's Showcase ONLY for their demo'r websites. They also do NOT endorse the practice of taking the photos off others' actual sites and have instructed demonstrators not to participate in this type of practice.

Be that as it may, people are still discourteous and unprofessional, as far as I'm concerned, when they take photos off others' websites, without permission and without properly crediting the true artisan.

I've only had 2 ladies request permission to use photos from my site, and granted it to them, with the explicit understanding that my name would be credited. Lorilynn is one . . . I can't recall the name of the other girl ...

Given the rampant "theft" of online images (yes, I consider it theft, even if the law does not), I make sure I watermark every photo I upload now that has something I designed.
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Old 09-09-2004, 04:13 PM   #36
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Quote:

Originally Posted by StephStamps
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lisa Lisa

Should I be offended that none of my cards are on there! LOL!!!!
My thoughts exactly....Its upsetting to know that apparently this lady likes Rebecca's husbands cards better than mine! JUST KIDDING

Yeah but how about being the wife whos husbands cards were used and not her own, and he stamped like three times in his life!
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Old 09-09-2004, 04:13 PM   #37
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Quote:

Originally Posted by spammie
Reminds me of a site I saw: Why you should never put your picture on the Internet:

Oh my goodness Marsha - that was a riot. I think Robin (Queen Avatar) would enjoy seeing that one!!

Ok, onto this subject. None of my cards were there but then I never really expected them to be (since most of mine are CASE'd to begin with). I found her site yesterday so it is kind of odd that this discussion was started today. I would venture to say that 75% (possibly more) of the cards on her site originated here. Is she a SCS'r? And if so, what are her thoughts on this - I would be curious to hear them. But, I'll refrain from commenting one way or another on the right or wrong of her doing it.
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Old 09-09-2004, 04:13 PM   #38
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Well said, my queen!!!
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Old 09-09-2004, 04:13 PM   #39
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Quote:

Originally Posted by PrideStampers
I don't agree with her taking credit for other people's art. But posting her website can effect her business...especially if her customers are SCS members.

She may be innocent and is just posting good ideas and didn't really think anything about it or she very well may be trying to take credit for other people's artwork and should be told that that is wrong...but now she is embarressed in front of her peers and customers that may be SCS members. I don't necessarily think posting her address was the right way to approach it.

Just my 2 cents.
I disagree, Holly. It's not innocent, even if she doesn't know any better, imho. "Theft" like this goes on all the time on the Net and ppl should know better than to take someone else's work without permission. Posting her address simply gives others a chance to see if they too are being taken advantage of. If she reads these posts she could apologize and remove the images and be done with it. Very simple.
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Old 09-09-2004, 04:21 PM   #40
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Quote:

Originally Posted by JulieHRR
It is my understanding that, anything put on the internet becomes public domain. Legally, we don't have any recourse.
.
This is a HUGE misconception. Here is a link for anyone interested. I apologize if I seem overly zealous about this, but I have been thru some legal troubles in this arena - having had my internet work copied and used without permission for much profit.

http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ1.html#hlc

"A work that is created (fixed in tangible form for the first time) on or after January 1, 1978, is automatically protected from the moment of its creation and is ordinarily given a term enduring for the author's life plus an additional 70 years after the author's death. In the case of "a joint work prepared by two or more authors who did not work for hire," the term lasts for 70 years after the last surviving author's death. For works made for hire, and for anonymous and pseudonymous works (unless the author's identity is revealed in Copyright Office records), the duration of copyright will be 95 years from publication or 120 years from creation, whichever is shorter."

"In general, copyright registration is a legal formality intended to make a public record of the basic facts of a particular copyright. However, registration is not a condition of copyright protection."

There really is no such thing as "public domain."

Go here for more copyright myths:
http://www.templetons.com/brad/copymyths.html
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