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Old 09-03-2018, 04:57 PM   #41
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If Spellbinders are made in China how are we to know they are safe?
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Old 09-03-2018, 07:24 PM   #42
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Most stamp companies' dies are made in the US, and the ones that aren't are by reputable companies (Sizzix, Spellbinders, etc.) who have visited their manufacturers (many post videos of their manufacturers) and they most certainly do not cost $1.

This was mentioned earlier in the thread, and may alleviate some anxiety about safety and/or other concerns...
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Old 09-03-2018, 07:50 PM   #43
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This is a hobby and a luxury - not a necessity. The Chinese sites often are selling stolen artwork from American/UK/European companies which have much higher operating costs than are found in places with deplorable working conditions, sometimes literally slave labor and horrible environmental practices.

I support the independents in the country I live in who are honest and care about their workers and the consumer. I'd rather save up and pay an honest price for a company that takes care of their employees than spend a dollar on something that came at who knows what human and environmental cost. I can do without until I can pay for a product I feel good about.

That's how I define a reasonable price.

And amen to shopping Goodwill, online BSTs etc. for bargains. That's a great way to get deals on non-counterfeit product.

Thank you for saying this, Lydia.
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Old 09-03-2018, 09:00 PM   #44
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Agree with the above post, but check your labels. Some sites that say "Made in the USA," make only some of their products in the U.S. - the rest elsewhere.

I am in agreement with the prices - they're getting high. $60 for one stamp/die combo; $20 for a die set that makes one animal??? That increase is not outpacing the rest of the economy. I appreciate the sales, but when they fall short of the increases, they just don't cut it.

Also, I've noticed several companies not selling out on their new releases as quickly as they used to, maybe this is response to price increases? Has anyone else noticed this slowing?
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Old 09-04-2018, 07:13 AM   #45
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I have to admit until reading this thread I have not given much thought to the safety of the products we are using other than the obvious, not breathing fumes, and keep away from hot or moving parts. It does make me wonder why products are produced where they are and how are they produced.

Back to the OP, I too think about how we were originally told that polymer stamps were cheaper to produce. That made perfect sense to me since we were moving away from a product using rubber, foam, wood, and some sort of index sticker. We frequently get a lot of stamps in a set, but the prices seem pretty similar to when we bought wood mounted stamps.
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Old 09-04-2018, 05:59 PM   #46
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But it still boils down to, so many of the items offered on the "China sites" are STOLEN WORK. And as someone else said, if we don't support the hardworking, legitimate companies, where ever they are, they will go out of business. Then the people STEALING the images will have nothing to steal and we all lose.
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Old 09-04-2018, 06:17 PM   #47
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Also, I've noticed several companies not selling out on their new releases as quickly as they used to, maybe this is response to price increases? Has anyone else noticed this slowing?

I suspect that's attributable to more than just price increases; I think market saturation and simply the vast number of companies you can buy from is probably a HUGE factor.
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Old 09-04-2018, 06:46 PM   #48
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I agree prices are going up. Here in Australia prices are ridiculous. We can pay at least twice the price of something from the US. There are no black friday sales over here and no coupons with 50% off anything in the store. This still hasn't stopped me filling up the spare double bedroom with crafting stuff. My first major purchase 9 years ago was $750 for a Cricut Expression. Now how ridiculous was that? The first cartridge I bought was Wild Card and cost me $120 from the same shop I bought the machine. I must have been mad to spend that kind of money but I so wanted one. Not so daft now though. I only work part time so if I want stuff I'll do the very occasional extra shift to fund my crafting addiction.
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Old 09-04-2018, 10:28 PM   #49
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But it still boils down to, so many of the items offered on the "China sites" are STOLEN WORK. And as someone else said, if we don't support the hardworking, legitimate companies, where ever they are, they will go out of business. Then the people STEALING the images will have nothing to steal and we all lose.

Amen!
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Old 09-04-2018, 11:44 PM   #50
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Partially on topic, especially in the light of what I said earlier about being surprised at the amount of Chinese sellers now on Amazon UK, I was reading this morning that most of them selling on Amazon (the feature I read cited stats from Amazon in Germany, but I'm betting the other European countries are the same) and eBay are not paying the VAT ( I think that's similar to your sales tax, but it runs to about 20% here) which is owed. Since that hurts governments, if they bring in legislation to enforce payment (which they are considering) perhaps that will somewhat curb the flood. One can hope.
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Old 09-05-2018, 04:38 AM   #51
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The facebook group site for canada (or australia or whereever) sounds great to me...

Speaking of...I was just wondering if there is a Canadian ebay or similar site?
Have you looked around bc there are a number of Canadian stamp companies who make cute stuff and I buy from them myself...

If the shipping inside of Canada is very high...well there is not much to be done about that...but as I recall some Canadian stamp companies do have free ship thresholds...if you can do shared buys with friends...

Kraftin Kimmie over 100
The old island stamp company 100
Frogs Whiskers no free but the ship looks reasonable if you have 2 cling or 4 wood...
scrapnstamp (gen supplier) whom I dont know is free over 100 and flat rate 9.50 under and they look to have a broad selection-some sets are crazy but the lawn fawn small sets are the same I would pay in NYC...some of the mama elephant that would be 15 to me are 19.50 to you....so higher but not 50....

I did see some of that 50-60 sets...yikes.

I can only assume that is the poor exchange rate. Cant help there.

Quietfire does not have free ship but I know they do it as a promo in itself at times if you get on the email list...

Scrapbook warehouse is free over 100, and oddly goes in reverse lower-65-99 is 9.50 and below 65 is 12.50 but could be normal here for heavy stuff.

I stumbled into a large list of Canadian LSS's on the IO site so if Canadians are in these towns they avoid shipping...

Impression Obsession Rubber Stamps: Canada Retail Stores

You may be able to back into it that way with other mfgs.

Or mfgs may ship direct to you for the right total amount-again do a group buy?

I am sure there must be more..but LSSs may not buy in the qties needed to get the best prices in the face of the exchange rate....

Maybe something there will be of help.
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Old 09-05-2018, 04:45 AM   #52
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Design rip off...just put ourselves in their place. You spend a few months on a design and then someone steals it. That would make me nuts. Mo Manning is big into this issue.

Horrible that those two companies got hit. I have noticed that I am seeing trademarks all over images now...sometimes to the point I cant see it well.

I agree prices are going up. Here in Australia prices are ridiculous. We can pay at least twice the price of something from the US. There are no black friday sales over here and no coupons with 50% off anything in the store. This still hasn't stopped me filling up the spare double bedroom with crafting stuff. My first major purchase 9 years ago was $750 for a Cricut Expression. Now how ridiculous was that? The first cartridge I bought was Wild Card and cost me $120 from the same shop I bought the machine. I must have been mad to spend that kind of money but I so wanted one. Not so daft now though. I only work part time so if I want stuff I'll do the very occasional extra shift to fund my crafting addiction.


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Old 09-05-2018, 07:09 AM   #53
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wow - interesting and very helpful thread. I started my paper crafting with rubber stamps in about 1993 - back when you'd stamp ONE image on paper (not quite as good as cardstock) and that was the card. I subscribed to one of the card making magazines, and thought the cards they demonstrated had way too much fluff to them.... several images, colored images, backgrounds, etc..the exact way I do mine now. Seemed like California has been ahead of the game from the beginning as most samples were from there. Over the years I became a little more 'advanced' in my card creations, and got the Baby Bug Cricut when it went on sale because the Expression came out. Still have my original bug, several years later my husband got me the Expression and then my brother bought me the HSN launch of the Anniversary Edition Expression with the 4 pre loaded carts. I use that machine the least of all - way too much work to do simple cuts. It was more work than fun trying to cut images. My 'plain' Expression is my go to machine. Also added a Cuttlebug (which was only used a handful of times - wasn't able to crank the plates through and even broke my C plate in half, it sits in the original box), have a Slice which was another gift from my brother (also, seldom used) and last fall the Gemini Jr. LOVE it. So, now that I have it, I started purchasing the metal dies. A friend in California turned me onto the dies from China, which I have purchased 3-4, but after reading these threads and how conditions MIGHT be for those workers, I think I'll skip even looking at those dies on EBay. I do get the small die of the month from Spellbinders, but plan on canceling that subscription after Christmas. I'm not very computer savvy, so the digital images are out for me. Also, being retired, I'm limited financially. I do have close to 1000 rubber stamps, and have been looking around trying to find donation organizations who might benefit from some of my craft supplies (like Girl Scouts, churches, veterans, etc). I did try a nursing home, but they said their patients don't have the dexterity to use rubber stamps. I still have those eye setting tools, but only use my Crop A Dile now. My brother bought me the WRMK envelope maker, and I presently attend a Stampin' Up class once a month. When we make cards, I try to reproduce them using the stamps and supplies I already have. I could probably give away more than half my rubber stamps and still have plenty to use. I do get ideas from Pinterest and several from you tube, but try to not duplicate them exactly. Most of the ones I copy are using fancy fold cards - just something different.

Thank you all for the responses, and for opening my eyes (and probably a few others) as to the expenses - and - manufacturing issues we all face in our paper crafting passions.

Happy Crafting to all !

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Old 09-05-2018, 10:01 AM   #54
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This thread has really had me thinking. I purchased one cheaper, but not ridiculously cheap die from China and was feeling pangs of guilt, until this morning. I finally went googling for what company this design was "stolen" from and after an exhaustive search found nothing. I found other dies that had a similar style but no die that matched the one I purchased.

I then remembered that when a couple of my daughters were married we purchase some custom stamps from a man who I think was in China. He worked with me via email customizing every detail that I wanted in the stamps and then mailed them to me. They were inexpensive but worked great.

I think it is important, as pointed out in the above posts, to look for stolen designs etc. but it is also possible there are honest craftspeople who happen to live in China. After all, reputable American companies are having dies manufactured there, so there must be some reason they are not making them in the US.
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Old 09-06-2018, 07:18 PM   #55
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Old 09-06-2018, 07:20 PM   #56
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Digital machines don't "feel" like crafting to me. I like the process of die cutting.
I'm the opposite, lol.
When I cut with my Silhouette, I spend a lot of time (and enjoy doing so) tweaking, changing sizes and making the fold lines less noticeable. It does feel like I'm practically designing sometimes, especially after I’ve taken the design into Photoshop to change and make it my own.

With my Vagabond, all I do is place the die on the paper and press a button. Mind you I do prefer the lovely edges the die makes.
I love it all though!
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Old 09-07-2018, 07:23 PM   #57
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Since the original topic was the high cost of dies and stamps, I wanted to mention an absolutely gorgeous stamp/die set that's all over the Internet today. It's a collaboration between Simon Says Stamp and Gina K for Stamptember. It's an absolutely beautiful Stamp and die set for Christmas. I'm an SU demo, but the samples made with this set were so stunning, that I clicked on the link and this Stamp/die bundle is $69.95!!! It's a 6 by 8 Stamp set, but the stamps set alone is only $25, so the dies are $45?!?!?! Way over-priced in my opinion! Gina K is a lovely person and I like SSS's stuff too, but I was surprised at how many comments said they had ordered it immediately. If it had bee $50, I probably would've too!!!
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Old 09-07-2018, 08:36 PM   #58
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I love that set too, but couldn’t believe the price. I have many of Gina K’s sets, and her kits are a good value. I want to order it, but just can’t at that price. Especially since I’m in Canada so we pay more for shipping and exchange and it would be well over $100. I wish it had been sold on her site instead of SSS. I don’t think she would have charged that much, but everyone needs to make money on it. I suppose I’ll just have to live without it.
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Old 09-07-2018, 09:28 PM   #59
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I haven't seen that set but there's no way I'd order it at such an exorbitant price. 100$ is probably what I've spent on my entire collection of craft paper and cardstock, coming up on ~5 binders worth. Yikes!

Is it this one? STAMPtember® Exclusive Limited Edition: Gina K Designs! - Simon Says Stamp Blog

If it is, it's not even special, good grief. Some trees, two mugs, a deer, ornament and snowflakes, plus some common seasonal phrases... I've seen all of those types of stamps many times before. Total hype train.
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Old 09-07-2018, 10:47 PM   #60
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I haven't seen that set but there's no way I'd order it at such an exorbitant price. 100$ is probably what I've spent on my entire collection of craft paper and cardstock, coming up on ~5 binders worth. Yikes!

Is it this one? STAMPtember® Exclusive Limited Edition: Gina K Designs! - Simon Says Stamp Blog

If it is, it's not even special, good grief. Some trees, two mugs, a deer, ornament and snowflakes, plus some common seasonal phrases... I've seen all of those types of stamps many times before. Total hype train.

That's the one being talked about.

However, IMHO, there's something even more outrageously priced: Dies used to cut sentiment strips - 6 dies, each 5" long, varying in width from 1/4" to 1"; plus 2 dies you can use to make them into banners. 6 RECTANGULAR DIES, people, FOR THE ASTOUNDING PRICE OF $39.99. I just checked to make sure my dimensions were correct, and they have sold out. (There must be a shortage of paper trimmers, or rulers/pencils/scissors, or good sense.)

I visited The Ton site earlier this week, and saw there were no black/white images of the stamps. It was difficult to tell what they looked like. I'm a huge fan, so I was upset. I sent them a message on FB. And received an immediate response explaining the situation. I replied that I totally understand and support them in their efforts.
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Old 09-07-2018, 11:01 PM   #61
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How gullible do you have to be to buy some little rectangle dies for 40$??! I just can't even imagine it. Please tell me people aren't that bereft of common sense. You can get a nice paper trimmer for forty bucks, and it'd do a heck of a lot more. I've thrifted two guillotine paper trimmers over the last year alone, they were 8$ and 6$ respectively.
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Old 09-08-2018, 04:16 AM   #62
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How gullible do you have to be to buy some little rectangle dies for 40$??! I just can't even imagine it. Please tell me people aren't that bereft of common sense. You can get a nice paper trimmer for forty bucks, and it'd do a heck of a lot more. I've thrifted two guillotine paper trimmers over the last year alone, they were 8$ and 6$ respectively.
LOL! That was exactly my thinking for the longest time. I don't recall what I paid, but those darn rectangles are the most frequently used dies I own. I can't tell you how often I've driven myself to frustrated distraction when I'm using my paper cutter and three sides are perfect and one side is just the tiniest bit 'not square' and the shaving and shaving off of that side until it doesn't exactly fit the card front ... argh!!!!!
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Old 09-08-2018, 06:48 AM   #63
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Yes, $39.99 is high, and takes advantage of the fact that videos influence buying. But people craft differently and have different budgets, and using dies for sentiment strips is as legit and acceptable as other methods, right?

I often use dies because I like techniques when using them to stamp sentiments straight and centered. Otherwise I tend to go wonky. #HateReDos.

So I get the appeal of buying a pack of different sized rectangles for sentiments strips - a one-time “forever” purchase. (My narrow rectangles happen to be in different sets, so the $39.99 set inspired me to pull them out to make a small-sentiments set.)

And while it’s great for crafters to discover finds at thrift stores, driving a distance to shop at one isn’t how I spend my time. I spent $89 for one of my cutters and am not ashamed to say it’s a top ten (five?) purchase, because CS can be clamped down, a bunch cut at once and is stable. We’re all different, that’s all.
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Old 09-08-2018, 07:31 AM   #64
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I have had those same thoughts over square, rectangular and sentiment strip dies. I haven’t caved yet but every time I see a nice window on a card front in one of those shapes or cut something wonky my thoughts shift a bit. In the end, the products that are worth the $ are the ones that actually get used and, as to the original reason for this thread, agree with your ethical standards.
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Old 09-08-2018, 01:51 PM   #65
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By that logic a $500,000 car is a justifiable buy, because you can drive it around. Just because you use something doesn't mean it was good value, especially when it's the retailers alone that are signalling what things should cost. There's an entire industry around marketing and price anchoring in stores that shows just how much the individual consumer gets manipulated. What Is Price Anchoring & How It Works? | Feedough

And why do sentiment strips have to be perfect? I thought the whole point of a hand made card was to give something personally made, that cannot be bought in stores. Get rid of the thought that cards must be perfect for therein lies a trap that shrivels creativity and stifles freedom. It's no wonder that cards suffer from 'sameness syndrome' if every part is cut by machine and assembled to a specific formula.
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Old 09-08-2018, 02:40 PM   #66
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my goodness, Embri, there's a lot going on in your post! For one ... there are a lotta folk who stamp for a lotta different reasons. Some have a crazy fabulous budget and just want to have fun, some (like me) are way more limited and need to think carefully about how and where they spend that budget. Some want to have something that looks polished, some want something that just expresses their love/joy/interest and don't want an end product that looks so forced, so perfect, it no longer represents who they are and what they're trying to express. I hope all have a place here, all feel welcome and not judged.

related to another aspect of your post, and fwiw, I like to think of things in terms of 'per use' value. If I buy something 'cheap' and only use it once, maybe it's not such a great value. If I buy something pricey, but use it over and over and over again, it's 'per use' value might be a heck of a lot cheaper than that great bargain that only gets used once.

I don't know about the dies that only cut banners, but the Spellbinders Card Creator sets, A and B have been a fabulous value for me.
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Old 09-08-2018, 02:45 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soozie4Him View Post
Since the original topic was the high cost of dies and stamps, I wanted to mention an absolutely gorgeous stamp/die set that's all over the Internet today. It's a collaboration between Simon Says Stamp and Gina K for Stamptember. It's an absolutely beautiful Stamp and die set for Christmas. I'm an SU demo, but the samples made with this set were so stunning, that I clicked on the link and this Stamp/die bundle is $69.95!!! It's a 6 by 8 Stamp set, but the stamps set alone is only $25, so the dies are $45?!?!?! Way over-priced in my opinion! Gina K is a lovely person and I like SSS's stuff too, but I was surprised at how many comments said they had ordered it immediately. If it had bee $50, I probably would've too!!!


I don't see this being much different than Stampin' Up. Take, for example, the Rooted in Nature stamp set that, as wood mounted bundle, sells for the outrageous price of $84.50 ($72.75 for clear bundle), and that is the price before shipping/handling and tax. It's a lovely set, but who can afford it?!

I don't really feel that every stamp in a set deserves a die. I'd rather have a stamp set that has maybe three or four coordinating dies, and costs much less. But I must be in the minority because crafters seem to want dies for every little image. That's probably why companies release die sets with so many dies, which costs that much more. Must be a demand for it.
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Old 09-08-2018, 02:47 PM   #68
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By that logic a $500,000 car is a justifiable buy, because you can drive it around. Just because you use something doesn't mean it was good value, especially when it's the retailers alone that are signalling what things should cost. There's an entire industry around marketing and price anchoring in stores that shows just how much the individual consumer gets manipulated. What Is Price Anchoring & How It Works? | Feedough

And why do sentiment strips have to be perfect? I thought the whole point of a hand made card was to give something personally made, that cannot be bought in stores. Get rid of the thought that cards must be perfect for therein lies a trap that shrivels creativity and stifles freedom. It's no wonder that cards suffer from 'sameness syndrome' if every part is cut by machine and assembled to a specific formula.
Marketing is clearly a hot-button issue, and that’s legit. (I thought I remembered you also posting about SU pyramid marketing - or maybe that was someone else.) And of course articles and books have been written and studies done about consumers being influenced aka manipulated to buy. I’ve read some over the years. So some points are well taken.

But if being willing to spend $40 for nicely stamped and cut sentiment strips means we’re gullible and easily manipulated, and that our cards suffer from sameness syndrome, and that it’s as dumb as spending $500,000 for a car, I guess I’ll have to own it.

But a crooked sentiment strip does not equal creativity, and is not the way I choose to show that cards are hand made. It’s just a crooked sentiment - which is 100% fine on others’ cards; I’d just rather not on mine.

Time to leave for a baseball game, speaking of effective season ticket marketing.
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Old 09-08-2018, 02:53 PM   #69
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I don't see this being much different than Stampin' Up. Take, for example, the Rooted in Nature stamp set that, as wood mounted bundle, sells for the outrageous price of $84.50 ($72.75 for clear bundle), and that is the price before shipping/handling and tax. It's a lovely set, but who can afford it?!

I don't really feel that every stamp in a set deserves a die. I'd rather have a stamp set that has maybe three or four coordinating dies, and costs much less. But I must be in the minority because crafters seem to want dies for every little image. That's probably why companies release die sets with so many dies, which costs that much more. Must be a demand for it.

Most of my dies are standalones. I tend not to make cards with die cut stamps that often, though I thoroughly enjoy them on others’ cards. In fact most stamps I buy don’t come with dies. Just a preference, and didn’t think it was uncommon, but maybe I’m wrong?
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Old 09-08-2018, 03:47 PM   #70
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The only dies I own that go with a stamp set is the Crazy Birds, and that's because I tried to cut out their little legs ONCE and said to myself, "Self, you need the dies, after all", and the Daydream Medallions because I like the way they layer.

I kind of view dies the same way I do stamps - if I can draw it myself or cut it myself, I don't need to buy a stamp or die to do it. If it's something I can't pull off myself that I think I'll use enough times to justify the expense (back to the "per use" concept), then I'll probably buy it.

As has been mentioned here and on other threads, we all have things in common and things where we differ, and thank goodness that this is true! Diversity is just as valid in crafting as in any other arena, I'm thinkin', and we need to be respectful of wherever anyone is on the spectrum...
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Old 09-08-2018, 03:57 PM   #71
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A few weeks ago, I went to Scrapbook Expo in Edison, NJ. At one booth, I saw a die set that matched a stamp set I had bought at another show. I almost bought it at a cost of about $25, but I decided to see if my Silhouette Portrait could cut out the images with the Pix Scan mat. I tried it out today, and the images cut almost perfectly. I couldn't have done it better with dies; that's how precise the cuts were. I do have some stamp sets with matching dies (bought before my Silhouette), and I paid (what I consider) a lot of money for them. I can't say that I regret the purchase, though. We all have to decide for ourselves how much is "too much," and how we want to spend our money. Personally, I wouldn't spend $50+ for stamp and die sets, because I think that is an outrageous price. However, my decision is not a judgment about what other people do. I just think that if consumers continue to purchase outrageously overpriced products, the companies will keep hiking up the prices - because they know that consumers will pay.
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Old 09-08-2018, 04:48 PM   #72
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Just to clarify, there's nothing wrong with buying the 500k car (assuming you can comfortably afford it of course) - the point was that nobody buys that kind of vehicle just for transportation. If 100$ stamp sets are your jam and that's how you like to splurge, so be it, hardly the worst thing in the world - but there's a whole lot of markup going on with no equivalent increase in quality or quantity in most cases. You may be paying for the brand or trend more than the product.

If you do cut a crooked sentiment strip, I'm not saying just ignore it. It's an opportunity, not a disaster; reach for a border die and make it pretty that way. Or deliberately make a triangle, or a wave. Layer something over the imperfect edge, etc. There's nothing saying you must have perfect rectangles every time except your own inner voice.

And yes, Stampin' Up is a pyramid scheme / Multi-Level-Marketing company, and I do believe I had pointed that out in another thread, so I'm probably the person you're thinking of bjeans. I know I'm probably one of the least popular people around here simply because I don't share the majority views, but that's okay. I'm used to being the odd one out.
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Old 09-08-2018, 05:14 PM   #73
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Interesting thread. Does anyone know where SU dies are made?

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Old 09-08-2018, 05:57 PM   #74
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Interesting thread. Does anyone know where SU dies are made?

Shirl

All the ones I've seen say Made in China.
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Old 09-08-2018, 08:44 PM   #75
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Just to clarify, there's nothing wrong with buying the 500k car (assuming you can comfortably afford it of course) - the point was that nobody buys that kind of vehicle just for transportation. If 100$ stamp sets are your jam and that's how you like to splurge, so be it, hardly the worst thing in the world - but there's a whole lot of markup going on with no equivalent increase in quality or quantity in most cases. You may be paying for the brand or trend more than the product.

If you do cut a crooked sentiment strip, I'm not saying just ignore it. It's an opportunity, not a disaster; reach for a border die and make it pretty that way. Or deliberately make a triangle, or a wave. Layer something over the imperfect edge, etc. There's nothing saying you must have perfect rectangles every time except your own inner voice.

And yes, Stampin' Up is a pyramid scheme / Multi-Level-Marketing company, and I do believe I had pointed that out in another thread, so I'm probably the person you're thinking of bjeans. I know I'm probably one of the least popular people around here simply because I don't share the majority views, but that's okay. I'm used to being the odd one out.

Yes, paying for the brand more than the product: classic example = jeans. $400 for an “it” brand?

I agree mistakes and imperfections are opportunities - and can even be fun - and have met crafters and instructors, and have read many posts by those agree and preach just that. No disasters here in the ink smudges that lie in wait and hyjack projects at the tail end. (And which just happened with a 3D birthday pizza box I made for my husband. An “opportunity” to turn them into stars and bursts.)

Not that my opinion matters, so ignoring/disagreeing is fine, but I think your ideas are thought provoking and worth considering - and that delivery can have an effect too. Not that you’ve said close to this, but as an extreme example, “Consider this... ” will be received differently than “Are you that stupid... “

Just my take YMMV.
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Old 09-08-2018, 10:57 PM   #76
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I'd call buying overpriced branded clothing gullible too. Assumption here that the branded clothing isn't any better quality than unbranded at a fraction of the cost. Buying a cheap shirt that you have to replace 10x over one that costs twice as much is not good value.

Gullible does not equate to stupid. It means easily persuaded or overly trusting. Smart people can still potentially be easily persuaded or too trusting because marketing and advertisement departments are pros at learning to exploit flaws in the human psyche we all have. Word of mouth marketing? Works because we're more likely to trust people we know than strangers. Price anchoring? Works because we tend to accept the abstract value someone else places on a thing, jumping on the bandwagon. Confirmation bias, or the tendency to look for people / ideas that agree with you rather than the opposite, then reinforces all of it.

We trust that the companies are obeying the laws, that they aren't exploitative, that they have the consumer's interests in mind at least somewhat. And most of them are decent at doing so, but there are some that are predatory. Some of them do not operate above board. The problem is it can be hard to see which are the bad apples until something goes wrong.

Everyone's opinion matters as much as anyone else's. *shrugs*
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Old 09-08-2018, 11:29 PM   #77
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Gullible does not equate to stupid”

Of course not, and I wasn’t implying they were the same. It was simply an example, albeit a poor one, that delivery matters too.
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Old 09-09-2018, 12:29 PM   #78
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Sooo you say you have wonky strips when cutting for sentiments??????
Well I bought a Tonic rotary cutter at least 10 years ago and absolutely loved it!
So last year I noticed that when cutting my layers there was always one side that crooked with either a side or top.

I started examining my cutter by running my finger along the groove where the cutting blade runs.
Guess what....bet you can’t!

About a third of the way down the plastic guides were no longer straight but actually had a tiny wow from years of using it going up and down the channel. I purchased a WRMK dirt cheap with coupon with 1/8 th increments on it and decided nothing ventured nothing gained.are my edges straight....You Betcha.

I was confused as to why all of a sudden I could not cut a straight line, rip Tonic Trimmer.❤️
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Old 09-09-2018, 01:34 PM   #79
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That's a good point, almost all tools wear out over time, especially rulers or anything where there's a lot of back and forth motion. Cutters, plates, craft knives; if you're cutting against it, expect that eventually you'll need a replacement!

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Of course not, and I wasn’t implying they were the same. It was simply an example, albeit a poor one, that delivery matters too.
My mistake then; that's what I interpreted you were implying. Glad we're all on the same page.
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Old 09-09-2018, 01:36 PM   #80
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Didn't I see a trimmer with a laser light beam (like some woodworking power tools have)? My trimmer is kinda like that old stove you learn to adjust to and accommodate its quirks (you know, like where the real 350 is and how long it really takes to bake whatever it is you're baking right? lol) and so I'll keep my dollars in my pocket for now, but someday ...
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