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Ok, the short answer is yes.. haha! Here's my dilemma. I recently got back into stamping. Yay! I have been watching lots of tutorials on youtube, to see some new techniques etc, as it's been several years. I saw that you can color in stamped images using alcohol markers without the stamped image ink smearing... IF you use the right ink.. I bought VersaFine Onyx Black. And I bought a starter set of Spectrum Noir alcohol markers... the Brights set. 24 markers for $35 at Pat Catan's. I'm very excited to try using them.. nervous though.. I don't know why.. afraid I will mess something up I guess. :rolleyes:
So, I have 12 Le Plume II markers and 1 Tombow (from years ago). Not sure where the Tombow came from... anyway... I really like being able to ink stamps with the Le Plume markers... they are great for layering colors and stamping one stamp with different colors etc. I've been looking up water based markers... Tombow and Marvy seem to be the two favorites...
My question, are there cheaper water based markers that will suffice? Not bottom of the line, but not necessarily top of the line either.
Also, are Sharpies considered alcohol markers? I have a huuuuge collection of them for my adult coloring books. Can I use them instead of the Spectrum Noir, or in addition to??
I think that's all in reference to the markers... thank you! I can't wait to get some replies.
Last edited by DreamsInPink; 08-25-2016 at 06:27 PM..
Reason: making corrections
Take the plunge and start coloring! The worst that can happen is you throw a piece of paper away ;)
There are a number of threads on markers, #11 in this thread gives a good description of inks, markers and papers. You can use Bics and Sharpies along with the Spectrum Noirs. The 36 set of the Bic Markits is one of my favorites for alcohol markers. I just bought a set on sale at Target for $19.99. They blend really well.
I have a wide assortment of water-based markers; Marvy, Tombow and Recollections. Marvy's are my favorites for inking stamps. The Recollections work well for color books but don't seem to have as vivid results for inking stamps.
I think that Memento Tuxedo Black is the preferred ink for using with alcohol markers, with no risk of smearing. It's not a true black, though, so if you can manage with Versafine, great! Just go on having fun. I can't offer advice as I just have a small set of Sharpies and my old LePlume markers. But yes, I consider Sharpies to be alcohol markers and use them if I want to try out background techniques using alcohol markers.
Sharpies, Bic MarkIts, Spectrum Noir, Shinhan Touch Twin, Prismacolor, and Copic are all alcohol-based and generally play well together. I don't have any Copics or Touch Twin, but I have all of the Spectrums and Bics and a handful each of Sharpies and Prismacolors. I use Memento Tuxedo Black with them most of the time, but I'm probably going to test other black dye inks that are "blacker" than Memento and see what happens (further bulletins as events warrant, lol).
I am TERRIBLE at using markers to color up a stamp, so I use the MISTI and carefully mask so I can do multiple stampings with multiple colors. I have some Crayolas (water based) that are much cheaper than the LePlume or Tombow, and I'm happy enough with them (don't use them that much, though).
Sue, you might try an India Ink Black stamp pad. I've been using this ink for 15 years, and it's my go to black ink. Doesn't smear, usually. And, it dries fast and really dark. Just a suggestion.
__________________ Keep what is worth keeping
and with the breath of kindness
blow the rest away.
Thank you, Carla! I know you are right! I need to just do it. I did take a look at that thread... that was helpful, thank you. I guess I just need to play around with what I have to see what works. Hopefully they work, because I really don't want to have to buy more.
Cook, thank you for the input. I did watch some videos on youtube and saw that Memento was the first choice for alcohol markers but the VersaFine was a close second. When I shopped, they were out of the Memento, of course. It's still on my wishlist.
I love versa fine but not for alcohol coloring. Mine always smears. I use the versfine for watercolor and memento tuxedo black for alcohol. I just use the Misti for a darker outline. By stamping it several times.
Ugh, really?? Well, I don't know what that tutorial was talking about then. I need to see if I can find it again. Maybe I misunderstood it. Am I allowed to post links to youtube videos here?
Yep. She put memento as one of top three for alcohol markers. If you watched her on the copics, versafine smeared. That's always been the case for me and alcohol based markers. When it didn't smear, maybe she let them dry a while. I usually stamp and start coloring and I can do that with memento.
Yes, but the top 3 ink pads were for all alcohol markers. I only have the Spectrum Noir.. she recommended VersaFine just under the Memento for the Spectrums. I don't have Copics.
Yes! Maybe she did let them dry awhile.. she probably did, since she was doing the big experiment. Which would be ok with me.. for now, until I can get my hands on the Memento ink pad. *hopefully soon*
I need to go play! Instead of sitting here on my computer. :rolleyes:
Well, I just went in and messed around a little bit. Sadly, I wasn't that happy with the Spectrums. :( It might be the paper I'm using... I stamped with VersaFine and Memories dye ink... I tried the Spectrums, Sharpies, Le Plumes (some of which are drying up), Crayola and Rose Art markers. I liked the Le Plume and the Crayola/Rose Art ones best. Maybe I'm just not an alcohol marker kind of gal.... *shrugs* But, it might be the paper too. I just using a scrap from a cheap note card. So, I kind of don't know any more now than I did before. LOL
I usually stamp and color on Georgia pacific 110# from Walmart but I must admit that I prefer copics to my spectrums. I think paper has a lot to do with it but I used what I have. With spectrums, I do much better using the same color to shade. I just use it over the shaded areas a couple of times and that seems to work for me better than shading with different colors.
Yes, its card stock. It says 110# but it isn't the heavy 110# like Michaels. And copics are great, but not so great on the purse! I only buy them if I find a bargain because sketch copics are $7.99 each at Michaels!
Hmm, I know nothing about papers... shouldn't 110# be consistent? Or no? I haven't been to a Michael's in ages.. I need to go! lol Oh gosh, I definitely do not want to try Copics. I can not afford that! :shock: I hated paying $35 for 24 Spectrum Noirs.. hahaha
There's a difference in weights that I don't understand. Something about gsm. But the Michaels 110# was better for card bases, although I've heard its now made in china. Dont know if that's true or not since I had a stash of it so I haven't bought any in a while. I'm going to go Michaels tomorrow to see what's new since I haven't been there in a while. Guess I had better get to bed now! LOL
The U.S. system is a bit confusing because the same pound number can be used for both lighter (Text) paper and heavier (Cover) paper. For example, 80# Text paper and 80# Cover paper have the same pound number even though the Cover stock is almost twice as heavy! The metric system in comparison is more straight forward. For example, 80# Text Paper weighs 104 g/m2 while 80# Cover Stock weighs 218 g/m2. The Cover stock is clearly more than twice as heavy as the Text stock.
Georgia Pacific 110# is card stock, and is about 200 gsm - Neenah Classic Crest is cover stock, and their 110# weight is 297 gsm.
Jennifer paper definitely matters imho. Esp with the alcohol inks. There are papers out there specifically geared toward alchohol inks. Spectrum has their own paper but I draw the line at any paper for alcohol should work for all them.
Here is an FAQ about Spectrum pens and at the bottom they will talk about paper and which inks to use for the stamping.
Alcohol paper is not cheap so it's one of those supplies that I grab when I see it on a good sale.
And to answer your original Q...yes I would get both b/c they do different things. But starting with one first is a good idea. It can get confusing if you are not a good note taker to try to run with both at the same time imho.
The nice thing about water based inks/pens is that you can do fun things with the re-inker ink straight like paint with it, but you can also get watercolor palletes...I am waiting for a good sale on the Gansai 36 myself. But that sends you off looking for the watercolor brush you like best...see what I mean? So hang with alcohol for awhile since you have that.
Over time you will want to educate yourself on papers. There are a number of kinds. This is one hole I fell into and got wrong paper for too long. Some people like to keep heavy paper like Michael's 110 as base stock and then other lighter paper to color on or die cut. I am still learning about it myself. WC paper just confuses the heck out of me no matter how much I read about it.
One thing I don't think was mentioned is that using a combination of alcohol inks with water-based inks. When I want to color a background but I don't want it to blend with other inks I use both types of markers. If the image is color with alcohol inks I'll use water based markers for the background because it will not blend or bleed the alcohol ink and vice a versa.
Alcohol inks are notorious for bleeding through to the back of paper. When I first started with Copics I took Copic International classes so I could get my certification and one of the first things they taught us was to look at the backside of the project and we should see a lot of ink bleeding through. This told us we were laying down the right amount to get the blending effect we wanted.
I have a lot of different water based markers because they all react differently but the one thing I learned is that IMHO it pays to spend a little money to get good quality and don't buy an entire set of markers because there will be colors you never.ever.ever.ever use.
I'm a Copic "snob" because I prefer the softer brush tips for blending. I have about 120 because that will give me the ability to get just about any color I want so there is no need to have more. I use the 3 shade method - you get the lightest, med, and darkest markers for a color than then you pick up color tip to marker tip to get the colors in between.
Coloring direct to stamp - I love the Marvy Brush Markers (not le plumes) and I only buy them direct from Uchida. They are not as popular as they once were but IMHO nothing works as well DTS and excellent when you need to mist the stamp.
SU & Tombow work about the same but since you can mainly only buy sets of SU I'd go with Tombow so you pick the colors you like. Tombows last forever but they aren't refillable.
When it comes to paper you will find the ones that work best for you. As for paper for alcohol markers it will depend on how you color. If you want superior blending then it's well worth it to spend the money to get good paper. But if you're just lightly coloring then it won't matter as much. Just remember about the bleed-through to the back.
No matter what you decide, I think it's best to get one or 2 of something or a small pack of paper and then just play because even though we offer up advice a lot of it depends on personal preferences and tolerances. I'm really picky on some things so my advice is purely based on what I like. : )
I wasn't consistently getting good blending with my Spectrums until I changed the way I do it. I start with the darkest shade and work my way to the lightest and they blend themselves pretty well as I go. Otherwise I had too much "definition" between shades and/or bleeding outside the lines trying to get a good blend. Didn't matter which paper I used, either, it seemed...
Thanks to all of your for the wonderful answers and support.. I see this discussion is blending with one of my other topics I posted, about paper. There is so much to learn.
Muscrat, did you go to Michael's? What did you buy?
Dini, thank you for that link! And the explanation. It's weird, that it's not consistent.
wavejumper, thanks for the link! I'm off to check it out next. I do think you are right.. I do need both types. I have some water based, just a pack of 12, Le Plumes. And then the 24 Spectrum Noirs.
stamphappy, I am learning about different ink types to use with markers.. I think I'll look into the Marvy brush markers.. why not Le Plumes? Are they not as good? I am just asking because I already have a set. How pricey are they? What about price of Tombows? Looks like I have some MORE research to do. lol I wish I could find some small sets of different papers... I'm not sure how easy that will be. *sigh*
Hello Sue! I tried that too.. but I just didn't like my results.. so far. Maybe I need to mess with them some more. It just seemed like the colors were so DARK. Do you use the clear blending marker? I don't have one... I just used the colors...
jeanne, hahaha!! Maybe that's what I should try too!!!
I have a level two Copic certification and about 200 markers, and I also have a sizable collection of LePlume and other water color markers. You have totally different coloring styles with each, and you'll probably find your own comfort zone by experimenting. I adore my Copics, obviously, but I love the speed and convenience of the markers. I did find, however, that actual water color sets are much less expensive than the markers. You can take your 50% coupon to a big box store and buy a large set of Koi with 25 or even more colors, much easier than using markers. When you want to color something fast and simple, water color. If you want something with lots of shades and details, alcohol markers.
I have a set of SU Markers and ZIG clean color markers - the SU markers work like regular markers and the ZIGs work more like contained watercolors - more blendable. My marker of choice is Copic - I really like the blendability and the overall look of copic coloring.
My cardstock choice, until recently, was Xpress blend it card but it is a little pricey. I discovered Spectrum Noir Ultra Smooth Premium White Cardstock at AC Moore and have been using that for months now. It's much cheaper and works great with Copics. I actually prefer it and often reach for it first because it is much weightier than the Xpress blend it card.
I have Tombows for water based colouring and colouring on rubber stamps and I have Spectrum Noirs for alcohol based colouring. They two different things and the results are different. Tombows can also be blended using a Dove blender pen if you wish and regular cardstock will work fine with them. I love Tombows dual end and also because you can buy them individually and get just the colours you wish to have. Tombows also do come in packs as well. I agree with the above thoughts that you need special alcohol ink paper for working with your markers. I love my Spectrum Noirs.. I have the whole set and use all the colours! I too start dark and work to light but you may wish to lay your colour down the opposite way. Both ways works. There are some great videos for Spectrum Noirs at spectrumnoir.com. if you find you really enjoy alcohol markers you can go for an accreditation. Just a thought. There are great tutorials available on the type of paper too. FYI.. I use the Crafter's Companion Alcohol paper and also by BEE Paper Co. Professional series artist marker pad... it's 110 lb.- 180gsm and is recommended for copics so you know it will work well with your Spectrum Noirs... hope this helps!!!
Someone mentioned affordable paper. A Canadian vlogger named Bumble Baylee suggested this paper, I bought some and it's fantastic. You MUST buy the paper with the frog on the packaging, and it's $10 at Amazon. I can not recommend it highly enough, perfect for alcohol inks. Hammermill Paper, Color Copy Digital Cover, 60 lbs., 8.5 x 11, 100 Bright, 250 Sheets / 1 Pack(122549R), Made In The USA
Do I NEED alcohol AND water based markers??
