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Old 03-18-2010, 08:31 PM   #161
This reminds me of a Star Trek episode....
 
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Hey Carol, welcome!

I just wanted to say I once dated a guy who was from Rockville, MD. Even visited him there. He was the last guy before my husband. So about 25 years ago.
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Old 03-19-2010, 01:27 AM   #162
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Hi Carol! Welcome! Thanks for sharing your history with us!
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Old 03-19-2010, 01:32 AM   #163
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Oh and Carol, I never believed in God. I mean I was in second grade saying the pledge of allegiance and thinking "one God? wow don't we things we're special."
I did believe in God, only in 3rd grade, when I first started to fully comprehend that written words (vs spoken words) also had meanings attached to them, I started to think God was evil because of what I was reading in the Bible.
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Old 03-19-2010, 07:08 AM   #164
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I'm new here; I just found the thread. Thought I'd introduce myself and tell you about my "spiritual journey," just as it is.

When I was young, I though I'd be a rabbi. I majored in philosophy and religion, and I went to a small liberal arts college in Pennsylvania that was affiliated with the United Church of Christ, so I did a fair bit of comparative religion. I fell in love and married an Irish Catholic boy from Boston who was educated for 8 years by nuns and 4 years by Jesuits. We both came from devout-ish families, and we were married by a Jesuit priest and a Reform rabbi in a beautiful ceremony that mixed parts of both faiths that were meaningful to us. We celebrated lots of holidays with both our families and exposed our son to enough of both faiths to allow him to make his own decisions. For a couple of years we attended a Unitarian Universalist church as a family.

Several years ago, it occurred to me to reflect that over thousands of years of human history, virtually every single culture has had a creation myth and a code of ethical behavior. What makes us so certain that the one we ascribe to -- the Judeo-Christian one -- is the only one that is "true?" We've all seen that ghastly bumper sticker -- God said it, I believe it, That settles it. Well, that *doesn't* settle it. That's how I became an atheist.

.
Welcome Carol! Glad you found us! I myself am a recovering Catholic. Unlike Sewsplendid, I was a slow learner (questioner?) like you. I sort of came by the route of "Why is it ok for for women to be treated like ****?

If you don't mind sharing, has your husband come to question god or is he still a churchgoer? Have you shared your change of mind with anyone?
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Old 03-19-2010, 07:13 AM   #165
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I'm still a recovering Cath-a-holic too. I believed all through Catholic school and didn't know there was another option. But I came around!
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Old 03-19-2010, 07:38 AM   #166
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Ok so I'm reconnecting (thanks FB!)with some cousins that I was very close to when I was little. And I have to say the God is GOOD spiel is getting to be too much. One cousin had a kid out of wedlock, then married another guy, had three kids, he's in jail, she divorced him, they had both had drug issues early on and she's a grandmother in her early 40s, course her oldest is going to Tulane next fall so good things too.

Well I'm chatting with her and she mentions she sells Avon because we were talking about my participation in the Avon Walk. She has been doing it to keep her head up as a second job since she doesnt' get child support and she says God is GOOD! Um what about just you working hard and being responsible to get as many jobs as it takes to support your family? How is God in any way helping?
I lost track of my thoughts here. I wanted to add a few thoughts
Where was god when she was using? When she was having abortions? When her mom was dying of cancer or her dad was smoking himself to death? Why didn't got provide for all those things?

I was thinking about some people's comfort of an after life, heaven. I see no comfort in that. What comfort is there is being gone from this world and missing everything. Or is the "answer" that you don't? You are different then. No remorse, no missing family and friends? Is the promise of being reunited that strong? What about the utter hopelessness of NOT being reunited with someone you care about who is not a believer?
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Old 03-19-2010, 08:16 AM   #167
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I was thinking about some people's comfort of an after life, heaven. I see no comfort in that. What comfort is there is being gone from this world and missing everything. Or is the "answer" that you don't? You are different then. No remorse, no missing family and friends? Is the promise of being reunited that strong? What about the utter hopelessness of NOT being reunited with someone you care about who is not a believer?
Yeah, I asked my sister about this recently in an email. No response yet.

I asked my dad this same question years and years ago when I was a kid. He said in Heaven, one would just forget about the people in Hell. I asked did he mean we would forget that they ever existed, so would not have to imagine them being in Hell. He said yes. I think he was just making this up and I doubt that there is a Biblical basis for his answer.

Also, according to a Christian co-worker whom I love to tease, there is NO SEX in Heaven!!! I told him "then what's the point????"
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Old 03-19-2010, 09:56 AM   #168
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SO wait one answer is just "you never knew them"? Or you forgot? Or you don't think about it?

Sounds like a lotta fun either way.
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Old 03-19-2010, 10:32 AM   #169
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I'm still a recovering Cath-a-holic too. I believed all through Catholic school and didn't know there was another option. But I came around!
I like your quote - Philosophy is.....
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Old 03-19-2010, 10:36 AM   #170
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My son and DIL left the day after Thanksgiving to travel to the Ukraine to adopt a little girl. They made it back home on Christmas day (w/ said new daughter) in time for dinner w/ the rest of the family. Now, granted, that is pretty amazing Ė they didn't even miss a holiday at home. But they give credit for the success and relative ease of their journey to god and prayer. Hmmm, I'm going w/ careful planning, dogged persistence, knowledgeable people helping them, and me paying the change fee for the return airline tickets
Good to hear the new family member is fitting in well. Weren't they supposed to be adopting 2 kids - maybe a brother and sister? Are they doing them one at a time? Or is the 2nd one a long term plan?

Good god what a good grandma
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Old 03-19-2010, 10:43 AM   #171
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Default Hans Kung calls on Pope to issue "mea culpa"....

Since they are several ex-catholics here, I thought I'd post this. Hans Kung is one of a number of theologians silenced by the church.

Dissident theologian Hans Kung calls on Pope to issue "mea culpa" for sex abuse


http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/com...cle7067069.ece

I probably shouldn't but I still keep up with the stupid things the pope and the church are doing all over the world.
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Old 03-19-2010, 10:50 AM   #172
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SO wait one answer is just "you never knew them"? Or you forgot? Or you don't think about it?

Sounds like a lotta fun either way.
Well....a Google search produced this useless answer by a Christian

(WARNING - lots of quoted Bible verses here!! Do not click if you don't want to see them):
http://www.christiancourier.com/arti...d-ones-in-hell

This is likely to be similar to any answer my sister might give me.

Can't make heads or tails of it. I got the impression he was saying "No one knows; I don't bleeping know either - just trust God to make everyone happy in Heaven - you [er, Christian you] will be happy no matter what."

Whatever.
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Old 03-19-2010, 11:06 AM   #173
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What I don't get is when somebody has a child dying of cancer or something. They say "We'll continue to praise god for this"...what??? Your child is suffering and dying. What kind of god makes a child suffer like that? What kind of greater plan would there be that makes it okay for your child to be in pain and dying? And they know they'll be reuinited when they die. Um, no. You won't see your child again.

Sorry but no.
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Old 03-19-2010, 11:08 AM   #174
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Since they are several ex-catholics here, I thought I'd post this. Hans Kung is one of a number of theologians silenced by the church.

Dissident theologian Hans Kung calls on Pope to issue "mea culpa" for sex abuse


http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/com...cle7067069.ece

I probably shouldn't but I still keep up with the stupid things the pope and the church are doing all over the world.
Like someone said on Dawkin's site, for every Hans Kung, there's a Dooley:

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/ne...-14726291.html

Lovely man, no?

I seriously hope that Catholics ARE outraged over this.
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Old 03-19-2010, 01:30 PM   #175
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I was thinking about some people's comfort of an after life, heaven. I see no comfort in that. What comfort is there is being gone from this world and missing everything. Or is the "answer" that you don't? You are different then. No remorse, no missing family and friends? Is the promise of being reunited that strong? What about the utter hopelessness of NOT being reunited with someone you care about who is not a believer?
My BFF's hubby lost his 12 year battle w/ cancer on February 25. During the last week of his life he asked for a priest to be brought in twice. He wanted reassurance that he was going to heaven even though he was a lapsed, divorced, remarried, non-practicing catholic. Huh? Silly me, I didn't even know my BFF and her hubby were catholics of any kind! But if having a priest tell Mr. Jack that he was going to heaven gave him some peace and made him less fearful then great.
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Old 03-19-2010, 01:37 PM   #176
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Good to hear the new family member is fitting in well. Weren't they supposed to be adopting 2 kids - maybe a brother and sister? Are they doing them one at a time? Or is the 2nd one a long term plan?

Good god what a good grandma
They were 'supposed to' be getting two girls. For a long time they were only 'shown' Ana and thought maybe the second would appear once they got to the orphanage. Apparently god is a little bit of a jokester - they found out my DIL was pregnant a couple of months before they left. They are expecting their newest daughter the end of May. See, two girls. Perfect sense
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Old 03-19-2010, 01:37 PM   #177
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I see no bad coming from getting comfort in the religious thought of an after life I just don't feel it. Anything that can be done to ease the distress of the person dying I'm pretty much all for.

My thoughts on all of this are pretty concrete. I don't even go to my daughters grave cuz I just don't feel like I need to stand there next to where her body has decomposed. Morbid? Maybe. It causes me to struggle with what I want when I die. What I want for my family. Will my kids want a grave to visit? Will they be ok with visiting somewhere my ashes were released? Will they feel like I do now and not need a physical presence to have a moment feeling closer to me? This is the tough pat that I'm dealing with right now. And in all of it I never think "well just in case God exists I'd better do..."
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Old 03-19-2010, 01:41 PM   #178
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I saw a uy at the gas station today with a shirt that said "God's got my back" Yeah I'm sure he really has all the time in the world to care about what you got going on buddy
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Old 03-20-2010, 06:51 AM   #179
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My BFF's hubby lost his 12 year battle w/ cancer on February 25. During the last week of his life he asked for a priest to be brought in twice. He wanted reassurance that he was going to heaven even though he was a lapsed, divorced, remarried, non-practicing catholic. Huh? Silly me, I didn't even know my BFF and her hubby were catholics of any kind! But if having a priest tell Mr. Jack that he was going to heaven gave him some peace and made him less fearful then great.
My friend's husband was a lapsed Catholic who suddenly got very religious the last year of his life. She had alwys been somewhat religious but not a Catholic. Just say the magic words and you go to heaven! He also died of cancer. I guess the early training still has too strong a pull. I hope I don't do that
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Old 03-20-2010, 07:04 AM   #180
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I see no bad coming from getting comfort in the religious thought of an after life I just don't feel it. Anything that can be done to ease the distress of the person dying I'm pretty much all for.

My thoughts on all of this are pretty concrete. I don't even go to my daughters grave cuz I just don't feel like I need to stand there next to where her body has decomposed. Morbid? Maybe. It causes me to struggle with what I want when I die. What I want for my family. Will my kids want a grave to visit? Will they be ok with visiting somewhere my ashes were released? Will they feel like I do now and not need a physical presence to have a moment feeling closer to me? This is the tough pat that I'm dealing with right now. And in all of it I never think "well just in case God exists I'd better do..."
I don't know how old you are (or how old your kids are) but have you asked them what's important to them? I remember going to the cemetery just about every week during the summer with my mom and grandma. I think of it as sort of an old world thing that is fading out. They would clean up the grave of my great grandparents, plant flowers, even mow the lawn if they thought it wasn't being done well enough etc. My parents did the same thing.

I feel sort of sad that my brothers and I aren't doing the same thing for my parents. We visit the grave occasionally. I don't expect my kids would ever visit my grave, expecially since they don't live anywhere near me. I guess I should ask them. I have already told them I want to be cremated and scattered somewhere.
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Old 03-20-2010, 10:34 AM   #181
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I'm 35 and the boys are 2 and 4 so it's not something they have an opinion about. BUT seeing as I never expected to bury my baby girl my age and health is not something I take as a guarantee that I'll be hanging around forever.

I've talked to my husband and he said he honestly doesn't know what he feels like he needs from me about that.
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Old 03-20-2010, 11:37 AM   #182
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Interesting about the graves, yes, we went to the graves, usually with my dad, on most major holidays and, of course, Memorial Day. Used to go to like 3 different cemeteries. I remember how boring it was, how cold and windy it usually was after being warm through most of May, and how quiet it was.

I have no idea now, with us being way out here and family back east - but MY kids might stay out here, or ... who knows? I honestly don't care about ME. It does seem "old world" esp. (I think) to those of us who've moved far from "home base."


On another topic, my guess is that people who are simply lapsed, who just kind of quit "doing the religious thing" might not have ever really thought about it. They might have just kind of stopped going, but never really quit the basic beliefs? They are probably way more likely to start thinking/panicking as they get old or sick.

I think, again a guess, that those who've actually thought enough about it to say "No I don't believe" will be less likely to "repent" at the very end. But who knows what our minds might do to us, fear, paranoia, at the very end.
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Old 03-20-2010, 11:56 AM   #183
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On another topic, my guess is that people who are simply lapsed, who just kind of quit "doing the religious thing" might not have ever really thought about it. They might have just kind of stopped going, but never really quit the basic beliefs? They are probably way more likely to start thinking/panicking as they get old or sick.

I think, again a guess, that those who've actually thought enough about it to say "No I don't believe" will be less likely to "repent" at the very end. But who knows what our minds might do to us, fear, paranoia, at the very end.
Good points, Wrose. I think you're on the track here.
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Old 03-20-2010, 05:47 PM   #184
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I'm 35 and the boys are 2 and 4 so it's not something they have an opinion about. BUT seeing as I never expected to bury my baby girl my age and health is not something I take as a guarantee that I'll be hanging around forever.

I've talked to my husband and he said he honestly doesn't know what he feels like he needs from me about that.
Thereís just no words to comfort a parent that has lost a child. ĎIím sorryí just seems so lame; maybe thatís why a lot of people say the innocuous things they do. I donít know when you lost your baby girl, but I am so sorry that you had to experience that.

My boys are adults and it never occurred to me to ask them if it even mattered to them if I was cremated or buried. My family in general has always done cremation w/ no service and Iíve never visited a grave site. I think of my dad when I work in the garden because thatís what he loved and I think of my sister when Iím crafting because thatís what she loved. And pictures Ė Iím so thankful for all the pictures I have of the people I love, both living and gone.

Your boys are so young I donít see how you could possibly decide right now about what would be best when you die and Iím sorry youíre struggling with these questions.
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Old 03-20-2010, 06:18 PM   #185
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Penn Jillette, the taller and more talkative member of Penn and Teller, did an essay for This I Believe a couple of years ago in which he laid out his core philosophy that people should be good because they are good people, not because of fear of some god or some eternal punishment. I think he's right. Thanks for reading this far.
Welcome, Carol. Glad you found us. I agree with this wholeheartedly. I try to do what is right because it is the right thing to do, not because of fear of punishment or whatever. Sin is such a stupid concept, and I think that the decisons that we really labor over are not things that are covered in the bible's list of sinnable acts. Like I don't talk to my sister enough, and when my mom (her stepmom) tells me I should call her I don't. Is that a sin? I doubt it, but it sucks just the same. (BTW just so I don't look like a really bad person, she doesn't call me either. That doesn't help does it? )
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Old 03-20-2010, 06:33 PM   #186
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They were 'supposed to' be getting two girls. For a long time they were only 'shown' Ana and thought maybe the second would appear once they got to the orphanage. Apparently god is a little bit of a jokester - they found out my DIL was pregnant a couple of months before they left. They are expecting their newest daughter the end of May. See, two girls. Perfect sense
Super congrats on the growing family! I don't recall if they were able to have their own children, but I think it is so interesting how that happens sometimes. I went to school with a family whose parents thought they couldn't have their own children. So they adopted a son and within a few years had two of their own children.
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Old 03-20-2010, 06:48 PM   #187
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I was thinking about some people's comfort of an after life, heaven. I see no comfort in that. What comfort is there is being gone from this world and missing everything. Or is the "answer" that you don't? You are different then. No remorse, no missing family and friends? Is the promise of being reunited that strong? What about the utter hopelessness of NOT being reunited with someone you care about who is not a believer?
My thoughts on this are not based on religion, more on what I feel and what I've experienced. As I've said before, I don't know if there is a God or not, but I feel that there is something more than our senses tell us. I really want to believe that there is life-after-death because I have a really hard time accepting that I will never see my dad again. I don't belive in hell at all. I feel that life is a learning experience and that we are meant to reach an objective each time around. My uncles believe that we set up certain obstacles and challenges for ourselves before we come back. With all that stated, I accept the fact that I could be completely wrong and there could be nothing...just the end. But I hope for more...
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Old 03-20-2010, 10:09 PM   #188
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My thoughts on this are not based on religion, more on what I feel and what I've experienced. As I've said before, I don't know if there is a God or not, but I feel that there is something more than our senses tell us. I really want to believe that there is life-after-death because I have a really hard time accepting that I will never see my dad again. I don't belive in hell at all. I feel that life is a learning experience and that we are meant to reach an objective each time around. My uncles believe that we set up certain obstacles and challenges for ourselves before we come back. With all that stated, I accept the fact that I could be completely wrong and there could be nothing...just the end. But I hope for more...
As all the various religions are so different it seems that all of us that question or donít believe are also so different. I donít want to believe in an after life. I choose to believe that our life is what we make of it and when it ends by death, weíre done. Itís just too exhausting to think weíd have to go through it again in a different manner to reach a different meaning.

As for the existence of a god Ė right now Iím in Woody Allenís camp, ĎIf god exists, I hope he has a good excuseí. Realistically, I canít believe in a Ďsupreme beingí because I would spend way too much time and energy being pissed off at it.

It seems like a lot of religion is al a carte, but I think if you believe in heaven you have to acknowledge the existence of hell???
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Old 03-21-2010, 06:05 AM   #189
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I LOVE that Woody Allen quote.

My Dad had such a conflicted relationship with God. He grew up during the Depression and WWII, and he lost so much of his faith after the facts of the Holocaust came out after WWII. He could never reconcile Jehovah's goodness and mercy with His allowing that to happen to the Jews.

The older I get, the more conflicted my own relationship with religion has become--I guess in my own time, that's come from seeing the degree to which people of every faith, across the planet, have used religion to justify their hatred and contempt for those who differ from them, whether it's 'Christian' hostility towards our gay brothers and sisters; an ultra-Orthodox Jew feeling entitled to displace her Palestinian neighbors because, although she emigrated from Russia a decade ago and her neighbors lived in the next town going back hundreds of years, SHE and her people truly OWN and deserve that land; a fundamentalist Islamic militant donning a suicide bomber's vests and setting out to destroy human lives; or a Hindu planting a bomb beside a Sikh temple.

I've always felt that the best and worst of ALL religions have everything in common: fostering in believers either a meditative, humble sense of gratitude, and the quest for strength and compassion to recognize and alleviate the suffering of their neighbors vs a smug and self-satisfied sense that THEY themselves--and they alone--hold a monopoly on all that's right and good and true, and anyone who disagrees merits pity or contempt if not outright destruction.

Yet from what I've seen over the years, orthodoxy will never suffice to alleviate all suffering, nor can the truth or reality ever be reduced to fit a single formula. Complexity an anguishing choices between obedience and compassion will always challenge believers. In the end, each must choose to find her own balance. I've found tremendous beauty and reverence in religion, and tried to find faith, humility and gratitude there. I haven't always managed to live out what I beleive as fully or obediently as I've hoped, but I've always felt the most strength and grace where I've recognized goodness and honored it--even where, as the Grateful Dead once said, 'once in a while you get shown the light in the strangest of places if you look at it right.'
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Old 03-21-2010, 07:48 AM   #190
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Thereís just no words to comfort a parent that has lost a child. ĎIím sorryí just seems so lame; maybe thatís why a lot of people say the innocuous things they do. I donít know when you lost your baby girl, but I am so sorry that you had to experience that.

My boys are adults and it never occurred to me to ask them if it even mattered to them if I was cremated or buried. My family in general has always done cremation w/ no service and Iíve never visited a grave site. I think of my dad when I work in the garden because thatís what he loved and I think of my sister when Iím crafting because thatís what she loved. And pictures Ė Iím so thankful for all the pictures I have of the people I love, both living and gone.

Your boys are so young I donít see how you could possibly decide right now about what would be best when you die and Iím sorry youíre struggling with these questions.
Sorry works, thank you
Natalie was born September 15, 2004 and died October 8, 2004
Somebody took me aside after the funeral and started in on the god's plan crap and how I needed to work past it and accept that she is where she needs to be.
Yeah not so much and eff you right back. We dont' talk any more
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Old 03-21-2010, 08:44 AM   #191
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Sorry works, thank you
Natalie was born September 15, 2004 and died October 8, 2004
Somebody took me aside after the funeral and started in on the god's plan crap and how I needed to work past it and accept that she is where she needs to be.
Yeah not so much and eff you right back. We dont' talk any more
I'm so sorry Victoria.
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Old 03-21-2010, 08:52 AM   #192
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As all the various religions are so different it seems that all of us that question or donít believe are also so different. I donít want to believe in an after life. I choose to believe that our life is what we make of it and when it ends by death, weíre done. Itís just too exhausting to think weíd have to go through it again in a different manner to reach a different meaning.

As for the existence of a god Ė right now Iím in Woody Allenís camp, ĎIf god exists, I hope he has a good excuseí. Realistically, I canít believe in a Ďsupreme beingí because I would spend way too much time and energy being pissed off at it.

It seems like a lot of religion is al a carte, but I think if you believe in heaven you have to acknowledge the existence of hell???
I don't think if someone believes in heaven that they must acknowledge the existence of hell - my friend from high school is a Christian and believes most of the Bible, but not the parts about hell. She said she just read those parts, rolled her eyes and thought to herself "oh, THAT can't be true." Also, I have the impression that Jehovah Witnesses don't believe in the same "hell" that other Christians believe in (the fire and brimstone one). Their "hell" is simply non-existence - the eternal deprivation of the presence of God.
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Old 03-22-2010, 02:06 PM   #193
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Welcome Carol! Glad you found us! I myself am a recovering Catholic. Unlike Sewsplendid, I was a slow learner (questioner?) like you. I sort of came by the route of "Why is it ok for for women to be treated like ****?

If you don't mind sharing, has your husband come to question god or is he still a churchgoer? Have you shared your change of mind with anyone?
If I minded sharing, I wouldn't be on this thread in the first place! It's likely that most everyone I know and love has heard my soapbox speech.

My beloved husband probably came to question the existence of god even before I did. He used to quote a famous Irish author (Brendan Behan, I think, but I could be wrong), who always said he was the only decent religion for an Irishman -- a bad Catholic. He did feel the need to take our son to be baptized, but I think that was as much hedging his bets as anything else.

Gerry passed away suddenly in November 2004, just before I took up papercrafting. It was a good thing I had good friends who were Catholics or recovering Catholics; his family lives pretty far away and it was funny to see the Jewish girl making funeral arrangements with the priest. I knew his father would rest easier knowing he'd had the Catholic funeral rites, and I didn't think it mattered much. The one place I put my foot down was that Gerry HATED cemeteries his whole life, and I wasn't going to make him spend eternity in one; I had him cremated.

Thanks to everyone for the welcome!
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Old 03-22-2010, 07:07 PM   #194
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There was a thread going on here at SCS a couple of days ago regarding cash and carry for SU demos (weíre not supposed to do it). Apparently I'm 'link' challenged today so I'll give the condensed version:

One person quoted 'Character is what you have when no one but god is watching'.

Someone responded: If God is watching SU demos to make sure they are not selling cs by the sheet, S/He must be having a very slow day. (gotta love it!)

The response to that was a rather ominous: God is watching. The consequences come later.

The conversation should have been basic right versus wrong. If you sign an agreement saying you wonít do something, you just donít do it. But 'god is watching and the consequences come later'? Really? Wow. Apparently some people can't leave god out of anything, including crafting. It's very frustrating. And it's also very frustrating that god can be brought up in almost any thread but I felt I needed to be respectful and keep my religious beliefs (well, lack of) out of a conversation about friggin' card stock so I didnít comment.

Have any of you seen the Kia commercial w/ the sock monkey and his pals? With the muno doll (the knobby guy) standing up through the sunroof with his arms thrown wide and 'How do ya like me now' blaring? I always think 'wow, that's kinda like gods attitude'. Childish, I know. But I think it every time I see that commercial.
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Old 03-22-2010, 07:09 PM   #195
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OMG I love that commercial. Wrose and a bunch of us were chatting on another thread and she said she recognized the toys all except the red one that looked like a fancy, um pleasure toy

seriously I was rolling on the floor.
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Old 03-22-2010, 07:25 PM   #196
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OMG I love that commercial. Wrose and a bunch of us were chatting on another thread and she said she recognized the toys all except the red one that looked like a fancy, um pleasure toy

seriously I was rolling on the floor.
Yeah yeah that was me. Super bowl commercial, and I'm like, what's with the dildo?

Seriously I had no idea it was a kid's show.

ha ha ha ha ha
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Old 03-22-2010, 07:27 PM   #197
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Originally Posted by virtualyvonne View Post
There was a thread going on here at SCS a couple of days ago regarding cash and carry for SU demos (weíre not supposed to do it). Apparently I'm 'link' challenged today so I'll give the condensed version:

One person quoted 'Character is what you have when no one but god is watching'.

Someone responded: If God is watching SU demos to make sure they are not selling cs by the sheet, S/He must be having a very slow day. (gotta love it!)

The response to that was a rather ominous: God is watching. The consequences come later.

The conversation should have been basic right versus wrong. If you sign an agreement saying you wonít do something, you just donít do it. But 'god is watching and the consequences come later'? Really? Wow. Apparently some people can't leave god out of anything, including crafting. It's very frustrating. And it's also very frustrating that god can be brought up in almost any thread but I felt I needed to be respectful and keep my religious beliefs (well, lack of) out of a conversation about friggin' card stock so I didnít comment.

Have any of you seen the Kia commercial w/ the sock monkey and his pals? With the muno doll (the knobby guy) standing up through the sunroof with his arms thrown wide and 'How do ya like me now' blaring? I always think 'wow, that's kinda like gods attitude'. Childish, I know. But I think it every time I see that commercial.
Yes it is frustrating. If you complain, Christians say they are being persecuted. You can't walk a block in this country without running into a LOT of Christianity, but don't spout off about not-believing or they'll REALLY get offended.

So while some Christians are complaining about feeling persecuted, the non-Christians are keeping their mouths shut so that their cars don't get keyed, or their blogs spammed, or whatever.
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Old 03-22-2010, 07:35 PM   #198
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Yeah I saw a plumbing truck today with a fish (Jesus fish is what we call it) worked into its logo. Do people really look up a plumber in the phone book and decide one over the other based on that advertised religiousness? Scary.
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Old 03-22-2010, 08:46 PM   #199
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If I minded sharing, I wouldn't be on this thread in the first place! It's likely that most everyone I know and love has heard my soapbox speech.

My beloved husband probably came to question the existence of god even before I did. He used to quote a famous Irish author (Brendan Behan, I think, but I could be wrong), who always said he was the only decent religion for an Irishman -- a bad Catholic. He did feel the need to take our son to be baptized, but I think that was as much hedging his bets as anything else.

Gerry passed away suddenly in November 2004, just before I took up papercrafting. It was a good thing I had good friends who were Catholics or recovering Catholics; his family lives pretty far away and it was funny to see the Jewish girl making funeral arrangements with the priest. I knew his father would rest easier knowing he'd had the Catholic funeral rites, and I didn't think it mattered much. The one place I put my foot down was that Gerry HATED cemeteries his whole life, and I wasn't going to make him spend eternity in one; I had him cremated.

Thanks to everyone for the welcome!
I'm so sorry about your husband!
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Old 03-22-2010, 08:51 PM   #200
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OMG I love that commercial. Wrose and a bunch of us were chatting on another thread and she said she recognized the toys all except the red one that looked like a fancy, um pleasure toy

seriously I was rolling on the floor.
I don't even want to know what thread you and Wrose were hanging out on! I didn't make that jump when I saw the big red knobby thing - I looked it up. Seriously, that's a kids toy?

I just equate the whole cocky (no pun intended!) attitude w/ what some people give their god credit for. I picture him sitting on a cloud, beer gut hanging out (not sure where that comes from), saying 'yep, how do ya like me now?!'

Side bar: the sock monkey totally freaks me out. That's the stuff nightmares are made of!
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