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Old 09-13-2011, 06:29 AM   #1161
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Default Lest we not forget...

Remember, 9/11 was the fault of secularists:

Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson Blame 9/11 on Organizations Like People For the American Way - YouTube

Unbelievable. Literally. Talk about division and intolerance.
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Old 09-13-2011, 06:34 AM   #1162
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Oh, and I spent the morning at my daughter's school, where we gathered around the flag, said the Pledge of Alleigance (sans "under God", at least on my part), sang the Star Spangled Banner, and had a few moments of silence during which I'm sure some people prayed silently to their representation of god(s). Which is totally their right.
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Old 09-13-2011, 11:28 AM   #1163
This reminds me of a Star Trek episode....
 
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Remember, 9/11 was the fault of secularists:

Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson Blame 9/11 on Organizations Like People For the American Way - YouTube

Unbelievable. Literally. Talk about division and intolerance.
Blame the Jews! Oh wait, wrong decade. And no German accent.
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Old 09-13-2011, 12:58 PM   #1164
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Falwell was forced to apologize:
Falwell apologizes to gays, feminists, lesbians - CNN

Also, I googled Pat Robertson. He founded CBN (Christian Broadcasting something - Network?), which became the Family Channel, which was bought by Disney in 2007! Disney, a supporter of gays!

Both of them are from Virginia, where my sister lives, and where Falwell's college, Liberty University, is made fun of by Christians who are even MORE conservative , who refer to it as "Liberal University"!!!
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Old 09-13-2011, 01:15 PM   #1165
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Soooo what you're getting at is Jerry Falwell is gay?


Your post made my head spin ROFL
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Old 09-15-2011, 08:08 AM   #1166
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Soooo what you're getting at is Jerry Falwell is gay?
Weeel, we never did hear details about the porn he was watching...
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Old 09-15-2011, 08:17 AM   #1167
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Weeel, we never did hear details about the porn he was watching...
Wait! What? I don't remember reading about Jerry and porn! Yet another self-righteous evangelical who can't live by his own very narrolwly defined set of rules?! Couldn't be!
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Old 09-15-2011, 09:20 AM   #1168
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Um, I don't think Falwell watched porn (at least, I didn't find anything through Google which said that he did)... he just said gays and lesbians and the ACLU were to blame for 9/11... which is far worse than just watching porn, in my opinion.
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Old 09-19-2011, 02:34 PM   #1169
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I had to share this experience yesterday and get some feedback.

My son is playing in a Fall HS lacrosse league. DH and another dad are coaching as the HS is not available and cannot coach in the off season due to PIAA regs.

One of our players was hit with a stick (very clean play) and fell flat to the ground. He wasn't moving. DH, the other coach and the ref ran over to him. He said it was his neck. His dad ran over and they called for 2 of the moms on our team who are Pediatric nurses. All of us were very nervous for several minutes until one of the nurses came back and said he was alert, oriented, had feeling in all his limbs, but still had a stinging sensation. All the adults around him felt it was best to err on the side of caution, not move him and call for the paramedics to take him to the local ER. (Turns out he is completely fine)

While this was unfolding, the player's mom was off to the side and was scared silly. She is a very funny woman, who is quite loud and the most supportive mom (of all the boys) you could ever meet. She saw her only child on the ground, wasn't sure what was going on and was terrified. She had one or two other parents with her.

Well...while all this is unfolding, a mom from the other team comes over and wraps her arms around her and starts praying over her! She starts saying "lift him up...etc..etc". Our mom thought it was a eulogy!! Of course, being the competitive mom she is, she was more pissed it was someone from the other team. She didn't want the opponent comforting her!! I don't know her belief system but I do know she was pretty annoyed and this only made her feel worse. I told her it was a darn good thing she didn't do this to me as I would have told her I don't believe in prayer, I don't believe in organized religion and get the _____ away from me. Now go and pray for my immortal soul because my guess is you think I need it".

I understand prayer is great and comforting to many and I completely respect that. But why do people assume that others want their religion? Not to mention it's pretty ballsy to go over to a stranger who is already being comforted by friends and say anything.

I'm pretty darn sure these same people would be apopletic and wouldn't view this the same if someone came over to them and started a Buddhist or Muslim prayer.

OK...I just needed to vent and I'd love some feedback.

and as to the porn topic...in my house they are referred to as "inspirational films"!
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Old 09-19-2011, 02:42 PM   #1170
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I would also be furious if someone started praying over me in an emergency situation. I hope I would also have the courage to tell the person to leave me alone.
Stephanie
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Old 09-19-2011, 02:55 PM   #1171
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OK you seriously can't type all that then add that last line LOL

Let's see....
Personally I don't give a hoot what people do inside their heads for me. But I draw the line at touching me or telling me you're gonna pray for me. If you ASK I'll most likely say yes. If you start praying instead of getting thee to a phone and calling 911 I might lose it.
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Old 09-19-2011, 02:59 PM   #1172
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I think if I was being prayed over, I'd loudly say "I'm not a Christian but thanks anyway". However, if I was being distracted enough by the terror of what was going on, I'd probably ignore her without even thinking about it (having all my attention completely focused on the hurt person). That lady probably assumed that the terrified mom WAS a Christian. I myself assume that everyone around me is a Christian. *SIGH*

On the other hand, if someone came up to me and started praying a BUDDHIST or MUSLIM prayer, as opposed to a Christian prayer, I'd probably turn my full attention to that person and just gawk in wonder (that SOMEONE around me ISN'T a Christian!!) and would be too speechless to respond in any way.
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Old 09-19-2011, 03:06 PM   #1173
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I thought the woman had unmitigated gaul to even go over to her. It was unclear anything was seriously wrong and she had friends with her.

She didn't ask first, she just started praying. I think the mom was so distraught that she didn't know what to say. (and she is usually NEVER at a loss for words).

Why people assume they can pray over you and they think it's completely permissable is beyond me.
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Old 09-19-2011, 03:19 PM   #1174
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The only way I can write these things off and still feel ok about the world is that I assume the prayer helps the pray-er deal with whatever situation. Does me no good. Often makes me roll my eyes and feel irritated. I'm still at a lose about people needed to pray out loud. I'm befuddled.
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Old 09-19-2011, 03:23 PM   #1175
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I think such people are showing off. Surely a silent prayer would be just as effective or is God deaf?
Stephanie
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Old 09-19-2011, 04:22 PM   #1176
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I think it's extremely rude and offensive. But if I said that to her she'd probably say I was persecuting her.
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Old 09-19-2011, 06:21 PM   #1177
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Quote:
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I think it's extremely rude and offensive. But if I said that to her she'd probably say I was persecuting her.
Ditto!
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Old 09-19-2011, 06:37 PM   #1178
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Default In a similar vein...

to Madge's post. The other weekend I was having dinner with my brother's family. My SIL said she was planning on reading a book about a 4 year old who had an NDE - a near death experience. I checked it out on Amazon. He went to heaven and saw Jesus and a sister who was supposedly still born. It was somewhat amazing how this little boy's description of Jesus matched exactly with what his father -the - minister believed.

Reading some of the comments it was clear that the parents could have been guilty of neglect since they waited and additional 3 days, after getting an initial diagnosis of the flu, to seek further medical help because it just wan't convenient.

I told my SIL that science has explanations for this stuff. They can stimulate parts of the brain and get the same response from people. Unfortunately, I forgot that my SIL had lost her mother only 2 months ago.
I sort of regreted what I said afterward but not too much. We don't generally talk about religion too much because they know my beliefs. I remember I sort of believed in that when I was still practicing my religion.
Now it just sounds stupid!
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Old 09-20-2011, 04:12 AM   #1179
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I think it's extremely rude and offensive. But if I said that to her she'd probably say I was persecuting her.
My thoughts exactly.
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Old 09-20-2011, 11:04 AM   #1180
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I'd say that lady needs a little red wagon to carry around her huge set of balls.
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Old 09-20-2011, 02:09 PM   #1181
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I'd say that lady needs a little red wagon to carry around her huge set of balls.

LOL!!!!
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Old 09-27-2011, 03:00 PM   #1182
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As a (rather conservative) Christian, I have to say I agree with what y'all have posted. It was inappropriate for this woman to come over and start praying over this mom. Did they even know each other? I would only do that if I knew the person very well- but I still probably wouldn't- that woman's son could have had a life threatening injury and her attention needed to be on him. Had I been witness to the accident, I would have stayed where I was, praying fervently for the injured player.

Hope it's ok to post here. I'm not trying to convert anyone- just like reading other ppints of view.
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Old 09-27-2011, 03:27 PM   #1183
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Hi Duranfan! It's okay to post here. You were respectful and like you said, didn't try to convert any of us.
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Old 09-27-2011, 03:36 PM   #1184
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Hi Duranfan - I agree with SophieLaFountaine that you were respectful of other people's beliefs. That is appreciated.
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Old 09-28-2011, 03:56 PM   #1185
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Uh oh. I have a moral dilemma. Hubby had me order a copy of Penn Jillette's new book, "God, No! Signs You May Already Be an Atheist and Other Magical Tales". It arrived today. I read a couple of chapters and am seriously ROFLMAO. My dilemma - is it wrong to tell hubby that it hasn't arrived yet so that I can sneak off and read it first?

From the first page of the book:

"If god (however you perceive him/her/it) told you to kill your child - would you do it? If your answer is no, in my booklet you're an atheist. There is no doubt in your mind. Love and morality are more important to you than your faith. If your answer is yes, please reconsider."
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Old 09-29-2011, 08:43 AM   #1186
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My dilemma - is it wrong to tell hubby that it hasn't arrived yet so that I can sneak off and read it first?
LOL. I always read the books first in our house - I read faster so his delayed gratification isn't delayed by more than a day or two. Plus, you got the book, so surely you should have first dibs, eh?
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Old 09-29-2011, 08:48 AM   #1187
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Have any of you ever been told that atheism is so negative? I've heard it from believers who think believing in god is positive so not believing in god(s) must be negative. I've also heard it from non-believers, in the context of "why define yourself as not-something?"

Here's an article I enjoyed: Is the Word “Atheist” Negative? | Greta Christina's Blog

Excerpts:
Quote:
Would you say that “non-violent” is a negative word? When you hear that a person or an organization is committed to non-violence, do you think, “Oh, they’re so negative”? Do you think they’re defining themselves entirely in terms of the very thing they oppose?
Quote:
Or take the word “unbiased.” Do you think this is a negative word, in the sense of being unpleasant or undesirable? Do you even think it’s a negative word in the sense of not having positive content of its own, and being defined solely in terms of what it isn’t? Or do you think “unbiased” is a good thing to be, a positive virtue to be pursued?
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Old 09-29-2011, 08:54 AM   #1188
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well I don't define myself as a non-believer or atheist. I'm a person who never thought god might exist. I tell people I don't believe in god.

But no I don't see the word as negative. I also don't see it as the opposite of believing especially since there are so any levels of belief and focuses (foci LOL) of belief.
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Old 09-29-2011, 08:56 AM   #1189
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Now are any of you watching Survivor?
I realize it's all in the editing but FORREALS Brandon is everything I dislike in vocal Christians. I know that sounds harsh but I don't personally understand why ANYONE is vocal about their religion/beliefs. My thoughts and feeling are so internal and personal I can't get past that in a lot of the witnessing that goes on.
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Old 09-29-2011, 10:16 AM   #1190
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Now are any of you watching Survivor?
I realize it's all in the editing but FORREALS Brandon is everything I dislike in vocal Christians. I know that sounds harsh but I don't personally understand why ANYONE is vocal about their religion/beliefs. My thoughts and feeling are so internal and personal I can't get past that in a lot of the witnessing that goes on.
What's that saying, religion is like a (redacted male organ)? It's fine to have one. It's fine to be proud of it. But don't whip it out in public and start waving it around.
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Old 09-29-2011, 05:49 PM   #1191
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Sorry to jump in on your conversation, but I just wanted to share this link. Has nothing to do with agnosticism or atheism, but it does have to do with clear thinking and science. I think several of you will enjoy it. For your viewing pleasure: Ben Goldacre: Battling Bad Science | Video on TED.com
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Old 09-29-2011, 10:51 PM   #1192
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I'd have to agree that atheist is not a negative word.

The man outside Target who's always asking for money for some "home" (despite the sign saying Target doesn't condone anyone begging) said to me as I passed by on Monday, "Bless you, have a blessed day" (even though I hadn't put any money in the jar).

I just smiled. I wanted to say, "but I'm an atheist!" LOL

It amuses me. DD said sometimes the guy is in a wheelchair, but it's just for comfort; at the end of the day, he folds it up and goes home!
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Old 09-29-2011, 10:53 PM   #1193
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Sorry to jump in on your conversation, but I just wanted to share this link. Has nothing to do with agnosticism or atheism, but it does have to do with clear thinking and science. I think several of you will enjoy it. For your viewing pleasure: Ben Goldacre: Battling Bad Science | Video on TED.com
And thank you for this! There is SO much bad science out there! I cringe when someone says "I don't think I can believe man came from monkeys." I cringe at a lot of statements - it's so obvious that people are simply not learning what science is. As he said - it's a welcoming of criticism!

So whenever someone puts forth a theory and does NOT welcome discussion, run away!

Thanks also because I watched a Michael Shermer one on the page, too. I'm reading a second book by him, so it was nice to put a voice to the writing.
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Old 09-30-2011, 02:50 PM   #1194
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What's that saying, religion is like a (redacted male organ)? It's fine to have one. It's fine to be proud of it. But don't whip it out in public and start waving it around.
You forgot this part: "... And please don't cram it down my child's throat."

I'm a Christian, but I still thought that was hysterical.
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Old 09-30-2011, 10:02 PM   #1195
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You forgot this part: "... And please don't cram it down my child's throat."

I'm a Christian, but I still thought that was hysterical.
I left it out because I think it's a little (lot...) crude, but yeah, accurate - don't want my kids religious experience begun by their public school teachers.

Luckily I live in one of the most (the most?) apathetic/atheistic states in the country. I don't have to worry about my kids being seen "at the pole" for non(ha!)-sectarian prayer, or having the ten commandments/prayers posted, or Christian prayers said at commencement (several years in the future for my kids, but it wasn't happening here even in the 80s here, per my personal experience).

I've discovered via gossip that most of my children's teachers are Christian, of the professed (not cultural) version. It doesn't concern me. I wouldn't be concerned if they were all homosexual, which I don't generally know. The reason I don't know is because they don't talk about it (their religion, or their sexuality) in school. Which is correct, and appropriate, and exactly the way it should be.
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Old 10-02-2011, 04:42 AM   #1196
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Default Almost spit my coffee at the screen for this one.

So, first thing this lovely Sunday morning... catching up on Facebook.
My "ticker" on the right lists a posting by someone I don't know and not on my friends list (really dislike that it does that) followed by a reply post from someone I also don't know.... but *liked* by someone I do know/is on my friends list which is how it made it onto my wall. How does this even make sense FB?

Anyway... here 'tis, hope you get a chuckle, too!

Unknown Person Status Update:
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Atheism- the belief that there was nothing & nothing happened to nothing & then nothing magically exploded for no reason creating everything & then a bunch of everything magically rearranged itself for no reason which then turned into dinosaurs.
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Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish zombie, who is somehow his own father, can make you live forever if you symbolically drink his blood and eat his flesh, while telepathically submitting to him as your master, so that he may remove an evil power from your soul which is present in all mankind because a woman made out of a mound of dirt and a rib bone was tricked into eating fruit from a magic tree by a talking snake.
I just about died.

In response to the game/injured player/ praying situation.
I don't like to be touched in general, so the touching may have been an issue... but if it was my child injured, I probably wouldn't even notice the praying. Everyone, regardless of what they were saying or doing would probably have been ignored unless it was about medical help.
Where I live... most religious people are Christians, and they assume everyone else is, too.
I agree with Stephanie - it does seem like those who are vocal about their faith are showing off - if you believe - -silent faith should be as effective if not more so. It also seems like operating based on fear that people won't "believe" unless they are convinced and pressured into it.

Many times, it just comes off as a marketing plan for churches, or blind faith, but wait, isn't that revered in some church circles?
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Old 10-02-2011, 04:58 AM   #1197
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--And welcome DuranFan! I have many devoutly religious friends and have great conversations with them about religion. I welcome alternative perspectives, love to think of things from other points of view.

I hesitate to speak for everyone, but my experience with this group (and most atheists) is that they have questioned and thought and investigated before deciding they were not theists. Just because they came to that decision does not stop them from being questioning individuals willing to hear other points of view! As long as the perspective and postings come from a place of respect and acceptance that it is OK to have different beliefs, all is well~
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Old 10-02-2011, 07:51 AM   #1198
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Anatomy of an Atheist - YouTube

Funny little 2-3 min.. cartoon.
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Old 10-02-2011, 02:26 PM   #1199
This reminds me of a Star Trek episode....
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post
So, first thing this lovely Sunday morning... catching up on Facebook.
My "ticker" on the right lists a posting by someone I don't know and not on my friends list (really dislike that it does that) followed by a reply post from someone I also don't know.... but *liked* by someone I do know/is on my friends list which is how it made it onto my wall. How does this even make sense FB?

Anyway... here 'tis, hope you get a chuckle, too!

Unknown Person Status Update:

Quote:
Atheism- the belief that
I get a kick out of people typing "atheism is the belief that..." because it's actually a lack of belief. Atheists by no means all believe the same thing!!!! Why don't people get that?
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Old 10-10-2011, 09:12 AM   #1200
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You all may have already seen this quote from Natalie Angier but I hadn't and though it was a good one.

"Religion is the opiate of the masses....and we all know you should never give drugs to kids."
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